Okay, so this sort of branches off from the other thread I made, about full sets.  Now you guys know that I am the "anti-repro" guy around these parts, but a lot of my "hatred" for the things is misunderstood.  So I would like to discuss the following topic.

There are some items where it is seen as okay to own a reproduction, such as the NWC cartridge.  Now this game isn't on most peoples' full set game list, though a few do feel it counts towards the set.  Given the circumstances with the NWC, would it be an okay substitution to use a repro and calling it a day, as opposed to getting the real thing.

But what about something like Stadium Events.  No one buys that game to play, but would it be okay to have a repro of the game in the collection, just for demonstration purposes?  Maybe for example, like a museum or something, wants to demonstrate the game and doesn't want to use flash cart technology.  In this sort of instance, it seems a repro would be an equally okay option to emulation, etc, where the important thing is the data moreso than the medium.

Another example, what about a game that has been counterfeited so much, that it is hard to know WHAT the legit copy is?  With this, we have Super Maruo on Famicom.  So many people (collectors, pirates) have made counterfeits of that game, that everytime a copy appears most don't even know if it is real or not, and when we are talking 4+ figures, it's not the type of thing one would want to take the risk on.  Is a repro then justifiable?

Let's discuss, when it would be justifiable to have a repro of a commercially released game (and I don't necessarily mean 1:1 copy either, and if you just want to say "never", also please don't respond).

I dislike repros as well, but I understand making a repro of a game that was never officially released which happens to have a r-o-m floating around on the internet. Two examples of which I own are Starfox 2 and Ghostlop.
Since it's easy enough to just put multiple games on a flash cart, I see most repros as pointless ventures that sometimes lead to someone trying to sell it as the real thing.

I have seen the damage repros do for Atari 2600. They drove the prices down for certain games like Halloween and Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

Seems like murky ethic territory, OP. You bring up a damn good point. Why shouldn't it be tolerated if it's tolerated with NWC carts? I think at the end of the day, there's really no "right" answer to these types of questions, and people are just going to do what they want to do regardless.

A reproduction should only be allowed with/worth having is homebrew or unreleased and if you wanna play little Sampson powerpak/everdrive. I don't think boxs/carts should be aloud to be made unless stated its fake but we know thatll never happen.

I am generally against the idea of repros. Though I do find it more acceptable for non retail stuff like nwc. Obviously these repros must clearly be repros and I do mean clearly. For me a little "reproduction" logo in the corner just isn't enough.

While thinking about this another thought crossed my mind. if I feel so strongly about repro games, why am I ok with art prints? Obviously no art collector is going to come to my house and say my god you have an actual Duerer hanging on your wall. I guess the answer may be self evident but I'm finding it difficult to articulate-- probably because I'm not really an art guy

If it was never released on the system it's on in the region it's on, and is clearly a Homebrew/repro I think it's fine.

ANYTHING 1:1 IN ANY WAY, SAYING REPRO OR NOT, is bullshit and is and should be illegal to buy, sell, or make. There is no reason for them other than to scam people. Flashcarts and emulators are better than that shit.

I'm conflicted about these things, although I guess I lean more toward disliking reproductions. That being said, I did recently purchase a few; these are unlabeled (I don't plan on putting a replica label on these carts), cart-only versions of expensive games. The total cost was less than half of what the Everdrive for the particular system costs, so I wanted to save some money; I don't plan on buying anymore repros, and I will eventually get the authentic versions of these games.

The complete 1:1 copying is the scary thing, as others have pointed out, whether it be the whole shebang (cart, box, manual) or even just the label on the cart. I feel a little better about my purchase because it is so clearly not the authentic version, but I do recognize that I could die someday and have these get out, have someone get them and slap a real-looking label on, and then there'd be a counterfeit floating around. It's a danger, for sure. I reckon I'll save up money in the future and just get the flash carts, as people suggest. But in a way, it does seem like asking a lot of people if they want to do these types of things for their own purposes (keeping in mind that the 1:1 move is still completely unnecessary and even more likely to cause trouble down the line). 

This is my answer as well. Repros of games that exist in your region, just to "drive prices down" should not be allowed to happen, regardless of whether they clearly state they are repros or not. But for games that were never officially released in a specific region I think it is okay. Games like Terranigma, Secret of Mana 2, EarthBound Zero, Mother 3, etc were never officially released in NA but without repros there's no way we'd be able to play them on an official system.

I don't have a problem with reproductions of the competition cartridges, since that is less about "filling a hole in a collection" than it is about sharing the experience of what competitors played during events that many of us have nostalgia for.

I think reproductions of "regular games" that are playable on flash cartridges are kind of silly, though, at best.
And of course, 1:1 reproductions just pollute the hobby, in general.

I feel NWC repros are a bad thing, but I won't give somebody crap for having one. I just personally wouldn't do it. I'd much rather flashcart it.
As others have mentioned, repros of games that were never released or localized are okay.

Depends on why you want to use it.

If you're doing a competition it's easier and cheaper to have multiple repros of the NWC than it is to have multiple flash carts, assuming it works identically on flash carts, at all.


Reproducing a competition cart is nothing like reproducing "production" games.  (esp. considering that reproduction NWCs are easily distinguishable from early 90's manufactured games)
Every NWC has provenance, and we've seen from past auctions that the provenance actually factors into the price sometimes, but at a minimum, people keep track and are HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS when new numbers emerge.

I'd doubt that anybody would ever be able to both make a compelling fake AND convince the community that it was real with a fake provenance.

Compare that with passing off a fake of a production title...

 

I feel that if it wasn't on the shelves in your country for purchase at retailers then I'm totally in support of repros. Even if it's something like Earthbound Zero (Beginnings), I'm all for a repro of it because downloading it to your Wii U doesn't compare to having a physical NES cartridge.

I dont want any repro close to my set.

It destroys everything. If you cant find a game or dont have the money to buy it. Dont fake it.

I think reproductions of commercially released games are a terrible terrible thing all around. I mean a 1:1 copy of the game? That's harsh.

Something like Star Fox 2 or a rom hack like the crazy Super Mario World I don't mind the idea of. A game that was totally UNRELEASED. Then okay... anything else, region or otherwise I'm not a fan of.

Not sure why the NWC championships were released....

I think if new homebrews are going to be made, though, there should be an understanding about cartridge colour and not use the original grey. I'm not a big fan of making shells available identical to those of the original. It makes it so much easier to make fake copies of commercially released gems (the most likely to be copied and as a result available on eBay right now) so why would production of shells that close in colour/specs be good in any way?

I think that the fact that you can get these games on an emulator in order to play if you'd like should be enough for someone who really wants to play a game. If you want the real thing, you should have to work for it and either buy it and pay accordingly or find it in the wild. This 100%. I feel it would damage the value of everything around it. Just a poison eating through your collection.
 

Games that were never released in the states - OK by me.

Hacks of existing games - OK by me (mainly because I see them with distinguishing labels and names compared to the original game)

1:1 Repros - Of course I take issue with this, for many reasons, all of which we all agree on.

Didn't we stir up a bunch of dirt when the label-less gold NWC came out. Did we all finally agree it was the real deal? Could we have been duped?

It's never, ever perfectly ok to do. You're breaking laws, always. It's just a matter of how bad do you want to be.
A repro of a translation if you own the original cart, is one thing. A repro of little Sampson because you can't afford little Sampson is a public service. It's a badge, telling all of us "Hey, I'm so fuckin stupid, I can't afford a game. So I wasted money (That I'm short on) to make a fake copy of a game. My collection is still just as incomplete, but hey, now I have a bit of plastic on my shelf to look at. Oh and I'm too stupid to use a flash cart or I like to tell myself 'it's not the same thing', because I think flash drives and eproms are different."

I think I've spoken out as pro-repro before. Hell I'm pro-emulators so that's that.

Anyone who accepts one form of piracy, but not another is really splitting hairs to justify his/her own "illicit" belongings.

Is a Little Samson repro worth $100+? To some peope it might be. I'd rather emulate it at that price.

Should someone make Little Samson repros? Sure, why not. Should people sell these repros (bootlegs in this context) to unknowing buyers as the real thing? Never in a million years.

See, to me it's not the object that's good or bad. It's the intentions of its owner. Just like OP mentionned : you create a Stadium Events for display purposes....what's the harm? But when you list it on eBay with a shady description and con someone out of a few Gs, that's harmful.

All, no.   Same thing with the 5-screw SE that popped up.   Lots of people believe it's real, but plenty don't.

Of course, I don't think you'll ever get all of us to agree on anything really.

 

$15 for any Genesis or Super Nintendo game you want.

http://nintendoage.com/forum/mess...

I don't mean to call this guy out or anything. I simply happened to see the thread earlier. Is it OK because no label is included?

the board was real. the issue was whether or not it had been swapped from a gray nwc to a gold shell. I don't know where that one landed, I lost interested. Nobody is making 1:1 copies of the pcb. The retrousb boards are a totally different form factor.

I think repro's are great. When someone repro's a game that was unreleased, translated, or so rare like NWC that not everyone can get their hands on a copy. So all that stuff is okay with me, as long as it is somehow different from the original and not a replica that could fool folks.

When folks are reproducing games like Bubble Bobble Part 2 which is a bit pricy but still very attainable. Or attemp to make an exact replica of a game. Those are the repro's that are not okay.

Seriously?  We have seen time and again that people who claim "this will never leave my collection" turn around and sell items that the collecting community were concerned about ending up in wider circulation.

Add to that... why would you want a fake of such a fuck-ugly cartridge for display purposes?


Owning the real thing, because it's the real thing, is one thing.
Owning a fake, of something that is neither fun to play, nor pretty to look at it, is just bizarre.

I wish these people bought PAL versions before wasting less money for a bogus cart.

True.

The "April Fool's SE" from a few years back is probably the single worst release that was ever tolerated by the forum both in terms of setting a terrible precendent for acceptable behavior and putting a reasonably large volume of fakes potentially on the market.