Originally posted by: portnoyd
Fair enough. I'll divest myself of this thread.
Only to return to make a thread such as this. You asked for it, you got it.
PART I: Let's get some shit straight.I'm not going to bullshit myself into thinking that this should be happyworld where everyone is going to trade each other fairly and not sell games to each other in a way that will sell themselves short. World doesn't work that way.
Caveats:Money makes the world go round.
Making money is not evil.
This is the world today and capitalism is large and in charge.
Profit is as good a motivation as any these days.
People will take advantage of each other any which way they can.
There is always a reason anyone does anything. Always.
All this considered, let's move on.
PART II: What is the VGA and why should you be completely against it?VGA is to Games as a Bathroom Attendant is to Restaurants. Both are completely unnecessary, add imaginary value to what already has value and let's be honest, it gets a little weird to have someone you don't know look over your shoulder while you take a leak, or in the case of games, it's a little weird to have someone who you don't know and don't have any reason to trust, takes your games, reseal them with the promise of "enhanced value" because of it.
Who are the VGA? Does anyone really know? The VGA was grown out of the CGA, the Collectible Grading Authority, a service for other collectible items, that has existed for at least the past 10 years. Seeing an opportunity to take on an entirely new market, they set their sights on videogames. Clearly, the CGA was not formed around games. This isn't someone known in the community coming to build up a service for other collectors, this is an existing service looking to expand their service to game collectors and to make money. This is a business looking to make money off of you with the promise that you'll make money yourself, so the model self-perpetuates and resistance to it becomes harder and harder. Also, by having your game graded, it becomes a self perpetuating model as you become an advertisement for them with each game you slab.
The promise of better protection, a definitive benchmark by grade and a certification are other advantages you get from VGA. But do you?
What authority does VGA have over anyone here to rate these games? Can anyone prove that it's just not arbitrary? I have yet to see anyone predict their rating with any accuracy. What makes the difference between a 85 and a 85+? And have they ever declined a game for being a fake seal? What of the conspiracy theory that they open your game up and take the game out or have knowingly or unknowingly graded reseals? There is no proven legitimacy to these concepts because they have you in a position where you will never be able to analyze what you have before you. It's a perfect stalemate.
You send a game in to be graded. They grade it. You will never open the case (you lose your money and time). You will never resubmit it to them to be regraded (you lose even more time and money). You will never open the sealed game (you lose even more money). If you are submitting the games to be graded, you are doing it out of concern for value of some sort: maintaining condition and therefore maintaining value, or increasing value. Point being, you won't dilute your overall value doing any of those things (If anyone has done such a thing as above, I'd love to here about it.). Do you really want to buy into something that has so many open ends?
Let's cover "enhanced value". Let's look at this breakdown this forum's own robin made recently:
Originally posted by: robin
So take the value of the game when it was released. lets say 50
then add 40 for shipping and grading
now take in to account that he had to find one dead mint, how long does that take, and how much gas?
so $90 + time and effort
minus ebay and paypal fees
minus whatever he will actually take as a
OBO.
That's a lot to put out for the enhanced value of VGA. So who wins in the end? Always the VGA. It's important to know that no matter what happens with the value of your games, VGA gets its money. If the seller robin mentions doesn't sell enough games to cover that expense, he's losing out. Yes, some of it is his fault for buying into it - it's his choice. But why subject yourself when the game itself will get you the money for half the work?
To summarize, my points of why you should not be involved with the VGA:
- Entered into the game collecting world as a business, not as a collector.
- Operates similar to a self perpetuating model that alienates those who do not use their service.
- No objective proof in methodology and certification.
- Stalemate model protects VGA, not you.
- Weak "value enhancement".
PART III: What about the supporters of VGA?What should you make of the supporters of VGA? They can be broken down into two categories: profiteer and curator. The curator end of it is pretty clear cut - they see VGA as a method to protect their games.
While they may sell in the future, they won't turn a game around for sale instantly. As a game collector, the inevitability is that you will one day sell your games. You will likely sell them at a profit. It's just the way things go. If and how you protect your games is the issue. Non-sealed collectors have their box protectors, sealed collectors have their slabs. Fine. It's your money to protect your games as you see fit, but I reference part II of this post for you and say: be wary and is $40 a game really that smart of a move to protect a single game?
The ones you have to look out for are the profiteers. This is also clear-cut. Those who slab games only to sell them on eBay and other avenues for profit. While there is nothing wrong with doing this, dealing with these people, you have to remember that they are akin to VGA in their goal: make money off of you. While profiting is well and good, profiting off you is something that you should avoid. Please don't interact with these people. You are more than welcome to find a copy of Super Mario Galaxy in stores and send it off to VGA. You can find a sealed copy of the game they have and slab it yourself.
Paying a fantastic upcharge does not make any sense when the resources and tools are at your disposal already if you really want them. Don't be a sucker. Don't fall for the grading numbers that seek to entice you. Be smarter than that. Look at the above and tell me you are placing your resources in the right place.
Part IV: Motivation & ConclusionIt's important to know where I stand. I'm a large proponent of keeping things where they are now. It lets the hobby be more accessible for those new and that they may be able to experience the fun that I did when I collected NES. I know that game collecting will eventually move into more advanced stages, approaching more defined stages of evolution akin to comic books and things will change. But the longer things stay as they are, the better. And I find VGA as a force that moves it away from that because it acts as a business force and creates profiteers, both of which moves it closer to comic books. While not an evil thing, the better situation in my opinion, is how we have it now.
So I say all this and what can you do or what can be done? The hard truth is VGA has taken hold of the sealed collecting gig and there is nothing we can do to resist it. Looks like sealed collectors are pretty much screwed since it's unlikely those who are already assimilated to the VGA mindset won't break the stalemate and those looking to get in won't be able to avoid it. Sorry! Should have fought the fight earlier on.
As I said earlier, there is a divide between sealed and non-sealed collectors. If you take anything away from this, it's that when VGA eventually opens up to CIB/loose cart grading, you say FUCK NO.
EDITED 3/1/10 7pm EST: Edited to remove pyramid scheme analogy.