Skip navigation
NintendoAge
Welcome, Guest! Please Login or Join
Loading...

Billy Mitchell's +1M DK records possibly done on MAME, not real hardware 4/12 update: Billy banned from TG and his scores removed

Feb 3, 2018 at 1:46:00 AM
Loxx O))) (19)
This user has been banned -- click for more information.
(Fat Man Kraid) < Bowser >
Posts: 7139 - Joined: 09/26/2016
Washington
Profile
Are people streaming old arcade and Atari games?

Feb 3, 2018 at 9:24:40 AM
JamesRobot (22)
avatar
(JamsGobot ) < King Solomon >
Posts: 3814 - Joined: 04/02/2014
Colorado
Profile
Damn! Sounds like Billy got chumpatized!

-------------------------
  

Feb 3, 2018 at 9:34:44 AM
cartman (16)
avatar
(The Boss) < King Solomon >
Posts: 3042 - Joined: 12/17/2010
Sweden
Profile
Meh who gives a shit

Feb 3, 2018 at 9:36:10 AM
Ichinisan (29)
avatar
< King Solomon >
Posts: 3718 - Joined: 04/08/2015
Georgia
Profile
Originally posted by: cartman

Meh who gives a shit


Probably anyone that watched King of Kong, which was hugely entertaining.

Feb 3, 2018 at 9:43:46 AM
DarkTone (2)
avatar
(GameCube Boss) < Bowser >
Posts: 6926 - Joined: 01/15/2013
United Kingdom
Profile
I want snoop dogg to try and get the high score (if the rumours are true)

-------------------------
"Vacations are dangerous! They give you too much time to realize you work too hard." - Dain

Feel free to help NA  here

Feb 3, 2018 at 9:44:44 AM
arch_8ngel (68)
avatar
(Nathan ?) < Mario >
Posts: 35266 - Joined: 06/12/2007
Virginia
Profile
Originally posted by: Ichinisan
 
Originally posted by: cartman

Meh who gives a shit


Probably anyone that watched King of Kong, which was hugely entertaining.

This definitely adds a great new layer to the drama.
 

-------------------------
 

Feb 3, 2018 at 9:47:55 AM
Tulpa (2)
avatar
< Wiz's Mom >
Posts: 11400 - Joined: 12/24/2013
California
Profile
Originally posted by: arch_8ngel
 
Originally posted by: Ichinisan
 
Originally posted by: cartman

Meh who gives a shit


Probably anyone that watched King of Kong, which was hugely entertaining.

This definitely adds a great new layer to the drama.
 
King of Kong II: Wiebe's Revenge?

 


Edited: 02/03/2018 at 09:48 AM by Tulpa

Feb 3, 2018 at 11:08:55 AM
cartman (16)
avatar
(The Boss) < King Solomon >
Posts: 3042 - Joined: 12/17/2010
Sweden
Profile
Originally posted by: Ichinisan
 
Originally posted by: cartman

Meh who gives a shit


Probably anyone that watched King of Kong, which was hugely entertaining.
It was entertaining but i can't get myself invested in these 30 year old video game highscores lol

 

Feb 3, 2018 at 11:47:36 AM
MODERATOR
MrWunderful (289)
avatar
(Corey ) < Wiz's Mom >
Posts: 12969 - Joined: 12/21/2013
California
Profile
I do have a lot of respect for the guys that can take such a primitive game and disect every little bit to get the highest score. So much repetition. Never been a scores guy myself, so hats off.

Feb 3, 2018 at 12:36:01 PM
MODERATOR
Gloves (110)
avatar
(Douglas Glover) < Wiz's Mom >
Posts: 10283 - Joined: 01/21/2017
Ontario
Profile
Originally posted by: Loxx O)))

Are people streaming old arcade and Atari games?





A fair few people do regularly stream old arcade cabs.

-------------------------
 

Feb 5, 2018 at 6:31:01 PM
Baddieboy Holden (0)
avatar
(Amiibo Collector) < Meka Chicken >
Posts: 807 - Joined: 01/28/2016
New Zealand
Profile
Mental. What's baffling is how long it takes for these World Records to be recognized as false.

-------------------------
Game Collection- 1025 as of 27/01/19 

Feb 5, 2018 at 6:48:23 PM
dragonwarrior83 (36)
avatar
(Nick R) < Meka Chicken >
Posts: 840 - Joined: 04/07/2017
Georgia
Profile
Billy Mitchell came off as a complete ass hat in King of Kong ( I watched it twice the other night ), his video submitted by his little monkey was clearly chopped up and edited. It's amazing how some of the people in the film looked up to him like he was somebody special, he's a small business owner with a hot sauce brand, his legacy? He will be off the leader board legitimately in a couple months after getting crushed by his competition, his legacy is hot sauce.

-------------------------
Got all 4 Dragon Warriors CIB, Thanks Everyone. Now looking for Dragon Quest ( Famicom ) 1, 2, and 3. Also a box and guide for Earthbound.

Apr 12, 2018 at 10:07:54 AM
teh lurv (118)
avatar
< King Solomon >
Posts: 4915 - Joined: 07/17/2013
Massachusetts
Profile
4/12 Update: Billy Mitchell has been banned from TG, his scores removed, and Guiness Book of World Records notified of developments: https://www.twingalaxies.com/feed...

-------------------------
My son... gives me Helpful Nintendo Hints that are far too complex for the adult mind to comprehend. Here's a verbatim example: "OK, there's Ganon and miniature Ganon and there's these things like jelly beans and the miniature Ganon is more powerfuller, because when you touch him the flying eagles come down and the octopus shoots red rocks and the swamp takes longer." And the hell of it is, I know he's right. - Dave Barry

Apr 12, 2018 at 10:11:26 AM
darkchylde28 (10)
avatar
(Doug ) < El Ripper >
Posts: 1364 - Joined: 01/12/2016
Tennessee
Profile
Originally posted by: teh lurv

4/12 Update: Billy Mitchell has been banned from TG, his scores removed, and Guiness Book of World Records notified of developments: https://www.twingalaxies.com/feed_details.php/1047/billy-mit...

Damn, you posted this while I was actully putting together a new post/thread with this as part of it.  Given that I was trying to discuss more than this, hopefully it won't get shut down and squished into the end of this thread.  

-------------------------
Need Stadium Events + Panesian titles, 6-in-1's, Menace Beach, Moon Ranger & Secret Scout to complete my licensed/unlicensed sets.

If you've got any of the above for sale, hit me up!

Apr 12, 2018 at 10:38:48 AM
arch_8ngel (68)
avatar
(Nathan ?) < Mario >
Posts: 35266 - Joined: 06/12/2007
Virginia
Profile
While it is sad for Mitchell that some of his legitimate scores were wiped (his perfect pacman game, for instance, was some kind of milestone as I recall) due to a total ban, this is a great teachable moment for kids about cheaters not being allowed to prosper.

When somebody cheats it taints everything they do that is within the same sphere of activity.


It will definitely be a new viewing experience to go back and re-watch King of Kong with this news in mind.

-------------------------
 

Apr 12, 2018 at 10:48:55 AM
captmorgandrinker (572)
avatar
(My Dick Smells Like Chapstick) < Bonk >
Posts: 17932 - Joined: 08/17/2009
Ohio
Profile
Gotta get those Billy Mitchell autographed posters on ebay!

Apr 12, 2018 at 11:12:54 AM
Ichinisan (29)
avatar
< King Solomon >
Posts: 3718 - Joined: 04/08/2015
Georgia
Profile
Far too late to save the reputation of Twin Galaxies, in my opinion.

Apr 12, 2018 at 4:25:48 PM
coinheaven (256)
avatar
(Joe Thomas) < Lolo Lord >
Posts: 1721 - Joined: 09/11/2007
United States
Profile
still glad we got to see this guy:




-------------------------
400 repros and counting:  http://www.thenesdump.com/...



Apr 12, 2018 at 4:52:42 PM
Andy_Bogomil (100)
avatar
(Pete ) < Bowser >
Posts: 6009 - Joined: 11/15/2012
Canada
Profile
Steve Wiebe is the man!

-------------------------
Wii U Collection Status: 160/161. Just Dance 2018. 

Apr 13, 2018 at 12:05:30 AM
Armageddon Potato (267)
avatar
(Daniel Tatro) < Kraid Killer >
Posts: 2304 - Joined: 04/28/2007
California
Profile
Originally posted by: arch_8ngel

While it is sad for Mitchell that some of his legitimate scores were wiped (his perfect pacman game, for instance, was some kind of milestone as I recall) due to a total ban, this is a great teachable moment for kids about cheaters not being allowed to prosper.

When somebody cheats it taints everything they do that is within the same sphere of activity.


It will definitely be a new viewing experience to go back and re-watch King of Kong with this news in mind.
I just want to add there was controversy over him having the first perfect pac-man score as that may have been falsely setup by Twin Galaxies for publicity reasons. It has since been proven he wasn't the first, and that Twin Galaxies already knew that when they claimed Billy to be the first.

"In September, 1982, Kathy Novak, Senior Market Research Analyst for Bally Midway received contact from Twin Galaxies that William (Bill) Bastable, of Closter, NJ, scored a Perfect Pac Man. On October 6, 1982, she issued a formal letter congratulating Mr. Bastable on his accomplishment. But, for reasons I don't wish to divulge here, Mr. Bastable's accomplishments were buried in favor of other, believed more socially marketable players."

Also I want to add in a lot of people were pointing at the "girder finger" from the screen wipe compared to pop up loading style differences as the smoking gun for Billy playing on MAME, but in my opinion there is a much bigger, much more concrete smoking gun that I really haven't see anyone mention. I've watched the entire Billy 1 million score tape in question. What I found is that the flashing 1up icon in the top left is a huge smoking gun. It goes up for about 8 frames, and down for 8 frames in normal play. However between stage transitions it sometimes stays down for over 20 frames, or comes back up right away. This is due to saving stating and then reloading between stages and replaying them. This also could be due to splicing some of the footage as they forgot to track the 1up icon flashing rate. This is the same thing that people got caught splicing runs for in Super Meat Boy with the flashing loading icon of Bandage Girl. Using it you can likely pinpoint each exact spot Billy save stated and then heavily reloaded or spliced. Also this correlates with the dispute claim that Billy got extremely higher points per stage from barrels and random elements than any other donkey kong player. This would completely explain that.

Another thing I noticed is the high score on both Billy Mitchell's Donkey Kong runs of 1,050,200 and 1,047,200 is default set to "007650" which I believe is due to it be playing it on MAME. Lots of people on Youtube casually playing Donkey Kong on MAME have the starting high score set to "007650".


Edited: 09/27/2019 at 11:07 PM by Armageddon Potato

Apr 13, 2018 at 4:01:45 AM
Totino (9)
avatar
(Sean ) < Crack Trooper >
Posts: 117 - Joined: 10/09/2017
New York
Profile
So who on NA wants to start up a new game record community? Twin Galaxies is clearly rubbish and untrustworthy.

-------------------------
Current Focus and Looking to buy for (I LOVE lots):
Sega Genesis - Loose and CIB
NES - Loose and CIB
Sega Saturn + Sega Dreamcast - CIB Only
SNES - Loose and CIB

PM me those deals yo!

Apr 13, 2018 at 7:02:01 AM
Trj22487 (25)
avatar
< Bowser >
Posts: 5791 - Joined: 07/13/2013
New Hampshire
Profile
Originally posted by: Armageddon Potato

"But, for reasons I don't wish to divulge here, Mr. Bastable's accomplishments were buried in favor of other, believed more socially marketable players."
 






Edited: 04/13/2018 at 07:03 AM by Trj22487

Apr 13, 2018 at 8:41:20 AM
Ichinisan (29)
avatar
< King Solomon >
Posts: 3718 - Joined: 04/08/2015
Georgia
Profile
Originally posted by: Armageddon Potato
 
Originally posted by: arch_8ngel

While it is sad for Mitchell that some of his legitimate scores were wiped (his perfect pacman game, for instance, was some kind of milestone as I recall) due to a total ban, this is a great teachable moment for kids about cheaters not being allowed to prosper.

When somebody cheats it taints everything they do that is within the same sphere of activity.


It will definitely be a new viewing experience to go back and re-watch King of Kong with this news in mind.
I just want to add there was controversy over him having the first perfect pac-man score as that may have been falsely setup by Twin Galaxies for publicity reasons. It has since been proven he wasn't the first, and that Twin Galaxies already knew that when they claimed Billy to be the first.

"In September, 1982,  Kathy Novak, Senior Market Research Analyst for Bally Midway received contact from Twin Galaxies that William (Bill) Bastable, of Closter, NJ, scored a Perfect Pac Man. On October 6, 1982, she issued a formal letter congratulating Mr. Bastable on his accomplishment. But, for reasons I don't wish to divulge here, Mr. Bastable's accomplishments were buried in favor of other, believed more socially marketable players."

Also I want to add in a lot of people were pointing at the "girder finger" from the screen wipe compared to pop up loading style differences as the smoking gun for Billy playing on MAME, but in my opinion there is a much bigger, much more concrete smoking gun that I really haven't see anyone mention. I've watched the entire Billy 1 million score tape in question. What I found is that the flashing 1up icon in the top left is a huge smoking gun. It goes up for about 8 frames, and down for 8 frames in normal play. However between stage transitions it sometimes stays down for over 20 frames, or comes back up right away. This is due to saving stating and then reloading between stages and replaying them. This also could be due to splicing some of the footage as they forgot to track the 1up icon flashing rate. This is the same thing that people got caught splicing runs for in Super Meat Boy with the flashing loading icon of Bandage Girl. Using it you can likely pinpoint each exact spot Billy save stated and then heavily reloaded or spliced. Also this correlates with the dispute claim that Billy got extremely higher points per stage from barrels and random elements than any other donkey kong player. This would completely explain that.
 

I don't think splicing would have been necessary. Someone (Apollo Legend?) said even those old versions of MAME supported TAS-like replays, so all Billy had to do was let it play back from start to finish. 
 


Edited: 04/13/2018 at 09:26 AM by Ichinisan

Apr 13, 2018 at 9:00:39 AM
dr.robbie (175)
avatar
(Robbie Pacanowski) < Bowser >
Posts: 6760 - Joined: 11/28/2008
Missouri
Profile
Not that anyone liked the guy, but I'm glad they're banning all of his scores. Cheaters shouldn't be given any leniency.

-------------------------
Let's Go Penguins!

Apr 15, 2018 at 8:21:59 PM
teh lurv (118)
avatar
< King Solomon >
Posts: 4915 - Joined: 07/17/2013
Massachusetts
Profile
Billy Mitchell released a statement regarding his ban and record disqualification:




-------------------------
My son... gives me Helpful Nintendo Hints that are far too complex for the adult mind to comprehend. Here's a verbatim example: "OK, there's Ganon and miniature Ganon and there's these things like jelly beans and the miniature Ganon is more powerfuller, because when you touch him the flying eagles come down and the octopus shoots red rocks and the swamp takes longer." And the hell of it is, I know he's right. - Dave Barry