2018, what's up?

2018, what's up?
by on (#218806)
I looked at 2016, and we had 12-14 project threads by this time (May).

Just asking, since I'm not sure.

Are we only submitting remixes this year?

If the regular rules are in play, are people working or planning anything?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218827)
I've had a lot less time this spring than i imagined at last years' compo conclusion, so i haven't put my mind to a new compo entry just yet. :(

The usual/remix question is a good one, that never got cleared up afaik.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218831)
I have no plans to submit a game this year.

I considered submitting a non-game music related program, in Category 2.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218850)
I have an idea for a simple game that I'm considering making for the competition. But I haven't heard clarification about whether it's a normal competition or not.

And who am I kidding, I'll probably wait until November again before I start on it :-)
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218853)
I was under the impression that there'd be a main category (64K discrete game), a remix category, and an anything goes category.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218857)
I'll probably make something small.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218863)
The life issues that killed Wrecking Balls turned out to be permanent. I'm still trying to get back into NESdev, but it ain't happening in a hurry. :(
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218868)
I just have no good ideas for small games :roll:
Depending on what state it’s in, I may end up submitting my current project in the non-contest category, just to finally get some publicity / feedback. Although I was originally planning for that to just be its own thing.

Of course, it would always be cool to collaborate with somebody.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218875)
No plans, no ideas, no time.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218876)
I have a couple of ideas. I hope I can start working on them soon.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218903)
Just like the last two years I'm hoping to make something this year as well (so we'll see how well that goes....), but nothing has been announced about the compo yet, so I think it would actually be weird if people start announcing entries at this point?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#218909)
Quote:
but nothing has been announced about the compo yet



"But the direction we were looking for is to have an annual schedule that can be copy pasted from one year to the next. Without letting deliberations on what we should do this time drag on to the point where they delay the compo."

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=15845&p=194085&hilit=annual#p194085

"It's concluded. Between the 3 of us the decision was made to stick to original deadline of Jan 31st. The goal is to have an annual compo that can be relied upon to end Jan 31st each year. If you've missed out on last year's compo, you're just in time for this year's."

viewtopic.php?f=32&t=14348&p=188030&hilit=annual#p188030

"Also, since we are going to make this a yearly thing, the contest will essentially be starting up again right away once we get all the info sorted from this(last?) years competition. "

viewtopic.php?f=32&t=14348&p=187738&hilit=yearly#p187738
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219711)
I'll definitely be trying to pull something together this time around.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219716)
I have plenty of ideas but I need to focus. I'll try to get started this summer.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219717)
tepples wrote:
I was under the impression that there'd be a main category (64K discrete game), a remix category, and an anything goes category.


I like the remix idea, but does it need its own category? How many people have intentions of doing a remix entry?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219718)
Maybe that'd depend on what counts as a remix. Changing the tilesets and music? Tweaking the physics? I guess they do. Then, should a remix compete with new games for the same ranking and prizes? Maybe. But it'll be a tough one to judge.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219720)
I thought up the remix compo mostly because I want the 53 games included in the final compilation to be the best they can be. If you think you can improve someone else's entry, don't hesitate to ask.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219740)
I'm not seeing a ton of support for a sidecompo. I agree that everything should be polished as much as possible for the final release, but at the same time some people might be hesitant or offended if they are really proud of their entry, but someone makes it better. Does that mean that their original version doesn't make it on the final cartridge?

If we want to make it an optional theme, that could work. Or if someone has an idea how a side-compo would be structured (prizes, carts, etc) please post here.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219741)
NESHomebrew wrote:
some people might be hesitant or offended if they are really proud of their entry, but someone makes it better.

That's why I recommended asking first, or remixing games released as free software (such as my own entries so far).

NESHomebrew wrote:
Does that mean that their original version doesn't make it on the final cartridge?

Ultimately, yes, it'd replace if better. Two Russian Roulettes enter, one Russian Roulette leaves. Two 2048s enter, one 2048 leaves.

NESHomebrew wrote:
Or if someone has an idea how a side-compo would be structured (prizes, carts, etc) please post here.

Let me summarize the rules of Famicompo Pico, an NES/Famicom music competition held once a year or so:

  • Four categories: Original NSF plus expansions, cover NSF plus expansions, original all gear, and cover all gear. NSF is limited to 1 MiB as per NSF spec, but entrants are warned that voters who listen on PowerPak won't be able to listen to entries larger than 248 KiB. No more than 5 tracks.
  • Each category has its own voting.
  • Two months from announcement to submission deadline; one more month for voting.
  • Entrants are expected to keep authorship confidential until voting is complete, in order to prevent voting based on name recognition. This means no self-promotion and no soliciting pre-submission critique from the public.
  • A cartridge is made of the top-rated entries among those that the project is allowed to distribute, so long as they don't use Famicom expansion audio or more than 64 KiB of data. Almost all of these come from the original category, but I was told a well-received cover of pre-1923 classical music would be considered for inclusion.

We might draw an analogy between Famicompo's cover category and this one-shot remix category. We have the same 64 KiB limit, but not the confidentiality.

One thing we might grade on is user-visible improvement, obviously. Another is value for space, as I worry about whether we'll be able to fit everything into a 16 Mbit cart (like Action 52 and the FFVII demake). An entry that allows multiple games that were formerly separate to share a PRG bank, such as by sharing the audio driver or text font or basic PPU interface code or whatever, might score points in value for space.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219758)
I was trying to work with a PC Engine port of my game (and subsequent remix to both platforms) but I got pretty discouraged at the end, not to mention I have very little time to work on anything right now. If someone wants to "remix" my game I'd be honored, but frankly I don't think it's interesting enough of a game for it to happen.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219762)
Pointed out again in the Assembly Line podcast that multiplayer-only games pulled in the tail end of the rankings last year.
I feel it's inevitable considering the judging system, but is there anything that can be done to further encourage multiplayer entries?
Perhaps a Best Multiplayer award and prize?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219767)
I agree. Multiplayer games are lots of fun when you bring someone over, but they get low scores categorically. It's kind of hard to require all peer reviewers to play them with a friend, so a differently defined prize for multiplayer entries or even a category of its own could perhaps be beneficial.

Multiplayer being defined as:
-2 or more players cooperate, compete and/or duel

not as:
-2 or more players take turns playing a single player campaign without any meaningful ingame interaction.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219782)
M_Tee wrote:
Perhaps a Best Multiplayer award and prize?


This is my suggestion as well. I love multiplayer games, so I think it'd be great if we had a better incentive for people to make/submit them.


Quote:
One thing we might grade on is user-visible improvement, obviously. Another is value for space, as I worry about whether we'll be able to fit everything into a 16 Mbit cart (like Action 52 and the FFVII demake). An entry that allows multiple games that were formerly separate to share a PRG bank, such as by sharing the audio driver or text font or basic PPU interface code or whatever, might score points in value for space.


I think part of the issue is that most of us submitting entries are more interested in coming up with new ideas and submitting them for the competition, then we are in the long-term goal of 53 great games on a cart. I mean, that's a neat idea, but it's not why I enter the competition, and so it's not going to carry much weight in terms of motivating my submissions.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219785)
I propose 3 categories.

1.new game or remix of previous game

2.multiplayer game (separate prize)

3.non games (no prize)
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219815)
I think having a separate multiplayer category would: reduce motivation to include a multiplayer mode into a main game (such as in f-ff), potentially lead to too few games per category, and remove the off chance that a multiplayer game could pull a prize in the main category.

Perhaps it would be better to simply have an additional question on the judging questionnaire, such as "Rate Multiplayer Experience: 1~5, NA"

The scores from the multiplayer experience would not add into the 50 point total for the overall score, but would instead be used for a separate ranking to establish, say, a 1st through 3rd place for "Best Multiplayer Experience."

This way, something like f-ff (which has both established single and multi-player) would potentially be eligible for both prizes.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219822)
M_Tee wrote:
Perhaps it would be better to simply have an additional question on the judging questionnaire, such as "Rate Multiplayer Experience: 1~5, NA"


That's not a bad idea. I'm vaguely considering submitting a game with 2 player co-op mode, and your suggestion would make a lot of sense for that sort of thing.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219824)
Quote:
would potentially be eligible for both prizes.


I don't think 1 game should be able to win 2 monetary prizes.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219828)
I agree with both. M-tee's suggestion is great, but it can be seen as unfair that multiplayer games can potentially win a higher summed prize than other games; however somewhat unlikely based on the history so far.

My suggestion would be that in the case an entry was ranked high enough to score both a normal prize and the "best multiplayer prize", the lesser prize of the the two would be passed on down that rank to the next highest entry. The entrant wins simply wins the prize representing the most significant achievement of the two, while being awarded the fame.

The difference between entries being multiplayer oriented or having a multiplayer component, and games that don't, would what prizes you might be able to win; but not how much the prize would be.

I hope this will incentivize people to keep making multiplayer games despite their categorically low ranking in the normal competition, and maybe even inspire to dare elaborate more on the player to player interaction element.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219829)
I haven't thiught of it deeply, but I kind of like the possibility of winning a bonus for multiplayer along with a normal award because it would encourage a rosk vs reward decision making process: Do I use a precious portion of my 64k to include a multiplayer mode or more single player content? Do I use a portion of my coding time to implement, test, and balance multiplayer or polish what I have?

EDIT:
...although with Frankengraphics' suggestion, that temptation would still be there, so no harm in going that way.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219878)
Actually, rereading FG's comment, I think it would be best to go that way. If I understand correctly, a single entry/entrant could win both prizes, but the lower of the two monetary rewards would just be passed down the line?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219881)
Yeah at least that was what i was thinking: If your game gets rated third best game overall and best multiplayer, your game is still 3rd best and so on. You keep the highest monetary reward, while the lower pne gets handed to the next best entry that would be valid for that prize. Would that work?

edit: Naturally, someone can't win two monetary prizes by getting a higher tier handed down, either. Then the lower of those two would be passed on accordingly.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#219907)
So should we go with 1st, 2nd, 3rd cash prizes + cartridges? Should we poll to see if everyone is on the same page with a 3rd category?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#220088)
I'm not sure i'd call it a category? At least not a category of entries. It'd be more like an award for the entries who meet and rank the proper criterium. I think of it like a film festival where's there's a special award for 'best international film', since they can't compete on the same merits due to the language (here: multiplayer) barrier.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#220108)
FrankenGraphics wrote:
I'm not sure i'd call it a category? At least not a category of entries. It'd be more like an award for the entries who meet and rank the proper criterium. I think of it like a film festival where's there's a special award for 'best international film', since they can't compete on the same merits due to the language (here: multiplayer) barrier.


I'm down with that. Any suggestions for the award? Are we thinking cash, or something else? We have done SNES mice with NES adapters in the past...
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#220438)
Just a little update, we are working on some stuff behind the scenes and will try to get something up ASAP.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#221316)
Just saying I'll try to submit something this year. Although I'll likely fall back to C as opposed to ASM due to time if that's okay?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#221318)
There’s no problem using C - there are just some limitations to mapper choice and size
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#221575)
Cool! I'm hoping to have Flap Happy ready by September then I'll look into NES game #2!
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#221595)
Hey guys check out my new Blaster Master hack. took out the Metroidvania and traded it in for Megaman!
https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/4082/
https://www.demonoid.pw/files/details/3879389/
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#221706)
NESHomebrew wrote:
FrankenGraphics wrote:
I'm not sure i'd call it a category? At least not a category of entries. It'd be more like an award for the entries who meet and rank the proper criterium. I think of it like a film festival where's there's a special award for 'best international film', since they can't compete on the same merits due to the language (here: multiplayer) barrier.


I'm down with that. Any suggestions for the award? Are we thinking cash, or something else? We have done SNES mice with NES adapters in the past...


Cash is simple enough. Most anything else increases labor / effort on the awarding end.

I'd say, what, $200?

Although multiplayer can go higher. by definition it starts at 2 players, so $200 seems like a nice round number.

I also posted in the awards thread about the possibility of retroactively awarding best multiplayer for previous years and a suggestion on what seems like the easiest fair way to do so.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#222996)
Just bumping this a bit. Is the competition definitely happening this year?
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#223036)
Yes, definitely happening. I'll see if I can get the responses I need by today or tomorrow.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#223484)
Bump. :) Honestly, don't really care about cash prizes, mostly just love the community and although I'm planning on starting a game (although I doubt anything more than a beta by end of year), I could see a competition/deadline creating some extra drive for me personally. Bumping the thread cos I assume the sooner everything is posted, the more time folks will have and therefore a chance for more entries.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#223487)
Deadline will be the same as last year Jan 31st. Main categories will be the same. Basically we are just trying to figure out what the "big picture" is regarding the Full 53 entry compilation cart, and then some prize amounts for multiplayer/remix stuff. I know I said a couple of days, but it's been a chaotic time for some of us. I'd post a preliminary thread, but I'd like the details ironed out first.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#223493)
"Full 53 entry compilation cart" meaning this? If so, I'll be happy to answer any questions about that.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#224689)
Just finishing drafting up the 2018 thread. Hoping to have the website finished up today or tomorrow as well.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#224880)
Hey! I don't know if this is the right place for this but I would love to join someone in a submission! I unfortunately only do music/sfx :(
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#225969)
Heosphoros wrote:
Hey! I don't know if this is the right place for this but I would love to join someone in a submission! I unfortunately only do music/sfx :(


I'm also looking for people to collaborate with. I have lots of ideas.

Music and SFX with Famitracker is probably the hardest part, so I would be happy if I didn't have to do that part. I would be best at pixel art. I have a lot of experience in high level software development, but not with 6502. I can write basic assembly code and I'm quickly gathering ASM skills, but it would be better if I were part of a team where another developer could help.

Some of my ideas (Feel free to take them):

- Red Riding Hood scrolling game where the forest gradually transitions to dead woods and then meet the wolf. (more of an 'art' game)
- Alien World Hide and Seek - 3D Walking simulator (think simplified World Runner)
- I Sing - You Sing - Listen to synthesized voice and sing back (playing by ear)
- Broken Robot / alien language - through trial and error, the player learns to control a robot by pushing buttons / entering code.
- WhoDunit - The player walks through a house (3D dungeon crawler format) interviewing people after a murder and chooses the culprit at the end.
- Reverse Hansel and Gretel where you play as the witch trying to capture children, turn them into pigs, etc.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#225971)
Welcome to the nesdev forums, thocolate. We were just talking about you in another thread.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=17543&p=225428
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#225980)
thocolate wrote:
- Reverse Hansel and Gretel where you play as the witch trying to capture children, turn them into pigs, etc.


I'd love to see this game as a deceptively casual resource management game, farming different parts of the woods for ingredients to create the assortment of candies, etc. needed for constructing and decorating your cute candy house in the forest.

It would only be at the game's end when an under-the-hood algorithm judges the appeal of your candy concoction and displays your final score in cartoony trapped kids, revealing that you have been playing the role of the Hansel and Gretel witch the whole time. :)
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#226027)
M_Tee wrote:
thocolate wrote:
- Reverse Hansel and Gretel where you play as the witch trying to capture children, turn them into pigs, etc.


I'd love to see this game as a deceptively casual resource management game, farming different parts of the woods for ingredients to create the assortment of candies, etc. needed for constructing and decorating your cute candy house in the forest.

It would only be at the game's end when an under-the-hood algorithm judges the appeal of your candy concoction and displays your final score in cartoony trapped kids, revealing that you have been playing the role of the Hansel and Gretel witch the whole time. :)


That's an idea, too. I was thinking more of the witch on a broom flying over and dropping pixel dust on unsuspecting children. Glad that a few people are anxiously awaiting Issue 1 of Dev Cart!
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#227458)
and here I was running on the uncorrected assumption that it was going to be A53-remixes-only.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#227478)
Myask wrote:
and here I was running on the uncorrected assumption that it was going to be A53-remixes-only.

Sorry, I don't know if I quite understand what you are referring to.
Re: 2018, what's up?
by on (#227479)
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11331&p=129746&hilit=action+53+remix#p129746
Being the fifth competition, and that, the fifth idea on there…and the rules threat for this year taking so long to be posted…
You probably don't need to worry about it anymore.