I was fixing an NES (72-pin swap) a couple days ago and it worked fine with just the tray assembled. Then, I continued reassembling it and put the metal RF shield and it wouldn't work anymore. I removed the RF shield and it started working again, so I just put the top back on and said fuck it.
Is there any REAL, NECESSARY purpose served by the RF shield or is it just FCC BS like the metal prongs in the cartridge slot of a Genesis for a 32X?
Honestly, if there isn't, I would rather just not put it back as that's the most time consuming part of a 72-pin swap because it has so many screws.
P.S. if it makes any difference, yes, I know about the way the tray clips to the motherboard and yes I know most aftermarket 72-pins only work in the "up" position.
P.P.S. I noticed that after the system was unplugged, if I pushed the power button it would flash the LED for a split second, is this because it isn't grounding due to the absence of the RF shield or is it just a capacitor discharging somewhere?
17daysolderthannes wrote:
P.P.S. I noticed that after the system was unplugged, if I pushed the power button it would flash the LED for a split second, is this because it isn't grounding due to the absence of the RF shield or is it just a capacitor discharging somewhere?
That's normal, happens all the time to me.
About the RF-shield, it pretty much speaks for itself.
It protects your video output from picking up 'unwanted cosmic signals', and makes your video output cleaner (As far as I know).
What a coincidence that you also were changing the 72-pin of your NES.
My NES on the other hand is now declared broken.
The shielding is probably also present to reduce emissions that could interfere with other devices. The FCC probably has fairly strict limits on what a device can put out in the RF spectrum. On the plus side, removing the coverting should allow things to run cooler inside.
so, in other words, I'm not doing anyone any major disservice by just scrapping the RF shield? That would save me a bunch of time when reassembling NES consoles. I found the video output to be A OK via A/V cables, and that's all most people are set up for nowadays with hi-def TVs and all.
BTW if anyone cares, I do console repairs for Play N Trade and I basically do NES repairs out of the kindness of my heart considering what both I and the store make off of repairing newer consoles like the XBOX 360, etc. Most people would say screw it and not bother, but I won't let salvageable systems die...ever. I'll even try to fix worthless PSX's if I have time and there is anything I can do (unfortunately, however, a new PSX laser costs more than a whole stack of used loose systems).
I would be pretty annoyed if someone doing some kind of mod to my NES removed the metal RF shielding without my permission. You could offer to remove it, noting that it allows the NES to run cooler. Everyone wins with this approach, and those few people who want it left in will be satisfied too. If enough NES units are repairable, you can still offer money for non-working NES systems, fix most, then sell them for more. You're still doing a service to someone who has a NES that might not be repairable, by offering something for it.
Nice you're keeping game systems out of the trash. Even if the console is broken, it's always useful for parts.
I would tell them if they even knew what an RF shield was, but the truth of the matter is that 99% wouldn't understand or know either way. If at all possible, I would still tell them I was removing it and give it to them in case SOMEHOW not having it caused a problem down the road, explaining that (apparently) they tend to be more reliable without it and it isn't really necessary. That way, if for collectors reasons they want it back in, they can put it, and I don't get a huge buildup of RF shields mucking up the place. However, most people just want it to work one way or another and don't care what is original and what isn't.
On the flip side, would you get mad if I didn't tell you I was removing the X-Clamps from a RROD XBOX 360, even though its a necessary step in order to replace them with screws? I can't see anyone really getting mad/annoyed about having the RF shield removed if the system functions perfectly. It didn't work, they brought it in, it works now, I don't see any wrongdoing there. Only a collector would ever really care that it was missing, and if they are THAT strict of a collector, they would probably do the work themselves and retain the original connector anyway (clean it/re-bend the pins, etc.).
It sounds to me like you've already made up your mind on what you're going to do about the RF shield or lack there-of.
koitsu wrote:
It sounds to me like you've already made up your mind on what you're going to do about the RF shield or lack there-of.
well my question pertained to functionality, not to whether or not it is right to remove parts for proper functionality without telling the customer. If leaving out the RF will make the Nintendo explode, then yes, I should always keep it in. If its just a nuisance that serves no useful purpose, then screw it, why put it back in?
Yeah, it's not a big deal, I just figured I'd throw in the minor-but-useful step of offering leaving it in as an option that you could discourage by noting it runs warmer with it on.
I would keep them there just because that's how they were put together regardless of the necessity.
kyuusaku wrote:
I would keep them there just because that's how they were put together regardless of the necessity.
Again though, what about the 360 analogy with the X-Clamps? Hell, I wouldn't use those metal prongs for a 32X even though they come with it and are listed in the installation instructions. If it adds a possibility of unreliability, why do it? Would you put back a redundant screw on a car if it caused the ECU to short out and kill the car while driving? no. So why do it here? As far as I'm concerned if the RF shield doesn't serve any important grounding function, it is the appendix of the NES and if I'm in there, I might as well remove it before it ruptures.
Sounds like the X-Clamps are something to speed manufacturing, unlike the RF shield. Again, its main purpose is to prevent the NES from emitting RF, rather than receiving it (anything received won't match all the RF that's inside the thing already). Your main complaint seems to simply be that it takes a few minutes to re-install, hardly an argument for its uselessness. But you don't have to make the case that it's useless; that it speeds things to leave it out, AND that leaving it out allows the NES to run cooler, are good enough reasons to do so in my opinion (I leave mine out, though I didn't throw it away).
Depending on what country you live in, it might be a violation of law to remove the RF shield and power on the NES.
^^most countries with some rf laws. Stil they'd have to notice and actually take the time to track you down. I doubt the nes emits THAT much rf to really be a trouble.
tepples wrote:
Depending on what country you live in, it might be a violation of law to remove the RF shield and power on the NES.
I think you're confusing the NES with that famiclone portable (game axe maybe?) that had a wireless TV antenna that would end up sending NES output to every TV on the block. Worst case (like anyone would ever complain about that, seriously) is that I would just claim I didn't know what it was for or why it was there and that it was keeping the system from working, so I just started leaving them out.
17daysolderthannes wrote:
tepples wrote:
Depending on what country you live in, it might be a violation of law to remove the RF shield and power on the NES.
I think you're confusing the NES with that famiclone portable (game axe maybe?) that had a wireless TV antenna that would end up sending NES output to every TV on the block. Worst case (like anyone would ever complain about that, seriously) is that I would just claim I didn't know what it was for or why it was there and that it was keeping the system from working, so I just started leaving them out.
No, I don't think tepples is confusing the NES with that. He's quite right: proper shielding ***is*** required by some countries (including the United States).
So the general opinion is: restore the RF shield, if not for legal ramifications, because the original system included it. If the RF shield is damaged beyond repair, tell the owner of the original system the truth, and explain the possible (but unlikely) risks. Seems simple enough. :-)
I have heard that the reason for the vastly disparate amount of RF shielding on the Atari 2600 (3/32" of cast aluminum) vs the NES (1/64" of sheet metal) is because the 2600 was the widely-spread computational device and the FCC didn't know how bad the RF would be. As it turns out, 1MHz with traces that are less than 6" isn't a problem, so the FCC relaxed the shielding requirements for future computers.
koitsu wrote:
17daysolderthannes wrote:
tepples wrote:
Depending on what country you live in, it might be a violation of law to remove the RF shield and power on the NES.
I think you're confusing the NES with that famiclone portable (game axe maybe?) that had a wireless TV antenna that would end up sending NES output to every TV on the block. Worst case (like anyone would ever complain about that, seriously) is that I would just claim I didn't know what it was for or why it was there and that it was keeping the system from working, so I just started leaving them out.
No, I don't think tepples is confusing the NES with that. He's quite right: proper shielding ***is*** required by some countries (including the United States).
So the general opinion is: restore the RF shield, if not for legal ramifications, because the original system included it. If the RF shield is damaged beyond repair, tell the owner of the original system the truth, and explain the possible (but unlikely) risks. Seems simple enough.
I'm not going to put something back that that has like 10 screws and then makes the system not work. I'm sure I've scrapped more than 1 pin connector thinking it was defective when it was probably the RF shield pressing down on the top of the tray, making the "up" position pin connector lose contact. I only get $10 for this mess, how bout I send them all to you and YOU mess with it for 20 minutes constantly removing and putting it back trying to get it to work again?
I didn't put mine back. Nothing bad has happened so far.
This looks to be a case of wanting to bend reality, or at least our perception of it, and wanting group agreement. It happens occasionally here. The solution is to accept that one is making decisions, and that they have downsides. Most real decisions do.