We, the greedy obnoxious company, believe that produce and commercialize too many similar games would be a commercial flop. But feel free to risk time and money yourself!  

2x!

getting closer to that 2020 release  

I like Oregon Trail enough if I run out of ideas in ~8 years and nobody has done this yet I'm going to do it with nobody's permission!  

Anybody is free to attempt to do a port of similarly styled game, but for me there is less incentive if someone else has already done one. I take my time with things, and someone else doing down thing similar is one of those risks. Whatever I do has to hit my own personal standards (late NES, early SNES), so there are no shortcuts. If I'm not happy with it, what is the point, I'll just feel the need to make another version immediately upon finishing it.

A smaller version of Spookotron is intended to be the hunting portion for FV, in case that was missed. Getting there slowly.

Why? Nearly every homebrew that comes out is a knockoff of something in some form.  Just change a few things, use your own graphics and characters and bam, you can't get a C&D. LOL.  Seriously this is an odd sentiment to me. Like, the whole point of this hobby is to make derivative works, isn't it?? I can think of a couple of games that are bordering on "truly original" but most of what we all make is some kind of knockoff, at least gameplay mechanics wise.

Yep, that was missed. I've seen Family Vacation thread not updated in a long while, that is the reason fro me to wonder about being an abandoned project by now.
Very happy to know that thing are still going on with it, and very curious to read about the finished product, once you will be done with it.
And, of course, very happy to let the little niche clean, for your game appearance. I cheer for your game to have the best possible (well deserved) commercial success too.

This is 100% true for a platform game. Huge creativity room beneath such umbrella.
A niche specific thing like Oregon Trail mechanics, it is different in my opinion. One is enough.
Just my two cents. I can be wrong.

Every time I see this thread I remind myself that Brony Blaster could be much worse in terms of delay   - This is NA's Duke Nukem Forever indeed!!!
In all seriousness, good news Beau! I'd definitely buy a copy  

I'd consider Oregon Trail more like a sub-genre, where there is a lot of room for alternatives based on different storylines, different mini game implementations, and different ways that the survivalism mechanics are implemented (in terms of utility of various supplies, their management, and how they impact story-encounters).

It isn't just reskinning a game and retaining identical gameplay, IMO.


 

Uhm... it depends on what you include under the "sub-genre" umbrella IMO.

If, to bring the concept to the extreme, you include Pirates! and a Rogue-like game in which you buy resources, to be in the same-sub genre, then of course yeah, there is plenty of room!

If you, to bring the concept to the extreme on the other side, restrict the circle to what clearly reminds the original game mechanics, adapted to new graphics, then two different ports competing each other would make little sense investment wise, IMHO.

And besides, honest honest, I am not a big fan of this game: too much randomness based, and too little strategy, for my tastes.

Being myself a freelancer designer, looking for opportunities to tackle successful projects, and so relying on 3rd party investing money on my work, it is rather important to me to propose projects where the genre proposed has little competition: from S&R (RPG), to AO (puzzle game unseen before on the NES), to Ninja (eye hand coordination game), to whatever potentially comes next.

Also because this could potentially improve the sales, or the selling price. I mean, taking this as an example: since people knows Family Vacation is a long term well polished project destined to be completed, maybe they save money for it, rather than buy a competitor product earlier. And the subjects investing money on my work, would prefer invest on something else, not suffering from that.

I mean, the market is already a tight niche for everybody, and differentiate the product offered from what others are offering (and from what yourself offered last time) it is a viable way to find and reach new investors and customers.

This is why I always look for originality and less recently-explored sub-genres when proposing a project: the best the things go when the producer sells the product, the more likely that he comes back to me. And besides, even if I plan to self produce stuff myself, the less competition from similar products, the best!

I hope that I do not look too cynical saying this: to have your creativity a bit conditioned by what the market is lacking at the moment, it is not so bad. You adapt, and better profit, sales, feedback, and overall appreciation, will make you happier anyways.

Just my two cents, I could be wrong.  

The part in bold there is where I'd personally disagree. If the point were only to be derivative or nostalgic, then I'd do something else; and the day that it becomes that is the day that I hang up my homebrewing hat. The whole purpose for me is to be creative. Creativity within certain bounds, and ones that happen to be tied to a specific period in time and technology, though they do not have to be. If writing a sonnet, a person is not derivative because they stick to the form, they are creative due to it. So too with platforms like the NES. For some it will be all about nostalgia, and that is fine, but perhaps that is one of the reasons why there are not many new people who are getting into the NES. Until we see technology and limitations in a different way, and I think that the decreasing leaps and bounds between the next gen and the current gen may cause this, then homebrewing is just a thing of the past. I don't read science fiction because it is old or new, I read it because it is a genre that I like. So too with platforms.

Of course, nothing is original, the hero has a thousand faces, and all of that, which means that creativity can be interpreted many ways. In cases that lack a heavily populated genre, creativity can be in how the parts are assembled. Everything has been done before, the parts are known, but how they come together can be unique. Such is the case with FV, I hope. In other cases, as with platformers or RPGs, I'd personally find creative joy in setting, narrative, or interesting gameplay concepts within the established framework.

That is just me though, as I do not get excited about the prospect of directly porting something. If there is nothing to figure out, or things to do differently, then my motivation tanks. Others take great joy in it, and make the games that I never will, and good for them. There are a lot of differences in the community, and that is great. Some love sharing constant updates, I do not. Whenever I share about something I feel like I let the air out of my motivational balloon. Instead I just keep quietly chipping away things. Others, however, get a lot of motivation from community response.

It is interesting that the two games that I have chosen to adapt are ones that I have not really played. I played the OT a bit in school, but mostly just spent time hunting. I do not think that I ever finished the trail. Only after I had planned out FV did I look at the Apple ][ version, and played it for all of ten minutes. Same too with Spook-o'-tron. Other than the independent moving and firing, most of it was worked out prior to playing or seeing Robotron. To some that will be blasphemy, since they want a port, but that's just not my style. I like seeing some loose concepts and ideas and then running with them. Maybe my take on things will be dead on with what inspired it, but at least for me the whole process will be original and creative.

As for the idea that someone else doing something similar causes me to lose motivation, that is just how I work. It is a small genre, and once it is done it is done. When choosing writing topics a professor told me to either be original or do it better than that last person, but in some cases one study on a topic is enough, even if your take is unique. Same with games, as far as I can tell; I'd rather make something new than crowd the platform. It is my own attempt to not reduce the NES and homebrewing to merely a thing of the past and instead make the platform a living, breathing thing that pushes forward instead of just looking backwards.

Okay so possible Oregon Trail themed games could be, reiterating here:

-Family Vacation (in progress and owned by SGP)
-Original Trail (dumb name I thought of)
-Oregano Trail (Italian themed, everybody is mario and luigi and you get pizza in manhattan)
-Origami Trail (japanese/asian themed, maybe base it on some awesome folklore..like chinese novel Journey West https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jou... which isn't Japanese originally I guess...but who cares about anything making sense, that's why we are into NES games right....?  right....????)
-Or Trail (binary/computer themed. Instead of dysentery you get a computer virus)
-Oar Trail (boat/sea themed, you travel west across the ocean and get SCURVY instead of dysentery)

I basically have the brain of a 10 year old and this all excites me greatly.

Or you are an underrated genius.  

ARR YOU HAVE DIED OF SCURRVY

somebody please make Oar Trail. *edit* You could have undersea fishing instead of hunting, with one of those old school diving bells or something. And there'd be krakens that could take down your ship and stuff.

YOU A GOT A CELIACS AND A DIED  << Oregano Trail

I fully 100% agree on this!
Rather than attempting a further stereotyped SMB game mechanics clone, I would quit designing games. Influences and inspiration is one thing, copy-past another. I could not agree more!

If somebody shows up and starts making a mega man knock off, I am so NOT ceasing work on my current game. It'll still be mine, still original graphics, still original music. I mean how original are we talking here is the real question. Profoundly original, where absolutely everything is brand spanking new including the mechanics, or just "original" as in your own story, your own graphics, your own music etc. I mean Battle Kid was sort of mega man like but that's not stopping me from creating another one. Course mine's scrolling, but, it's still roughly the same jump n shoot mechanics with robots and megaman like music.

My personal position is you should just make what you want, regardless of what other people are doing except where copyright is a concern. It will probably be original enough that people will want it. Short of making a game called Muper Barrio Srothers I don't see how one can fail to make something original "enough."

*edit* Google's Play store is littered with exactly the sort of thing I think none of us are talking about. There are literal actual knockoffs of mario and mega man all over the place, extremely poorly executed, and while the graphics are still "original" they don't even attempt to make new characters. THAT I think we all agree is something we don't want to do in this scene. At least all homebrews that have come out are original in some form, that I can tell.

Differences of philosophy and motivation, but I think that we each know ourselves enough to know what we need to get up earlier in the morning or stay up later at night  . Finishing a large project takes a lot more than simply willing it.

This is 100% true and correct.

However, there are things legal and illegal, legit and not legit, elegant and inelegant. SOmething can be legit, and legal, and still inelegant.

If you know that a friend (who invested his money on your work in the past) is working on a project, since a long time and putting tons of dedication into it, you will not step on his toes messing up with its potential market and sales. In case that he quits the project, or after its product is already released and sold enough to cover the costs, then you could; else you will not, no matter now greedy you are, and this for self respect and care for your reputation before anything else: you take not advantage of something like that, towards a friend. Besides, it is little professional anyways to steal ideas and projects.

I mean, we are not talking about what is legal and legit, we are talking about what is fair within two people sharing info about their projects, believing to be in a friendly and safe environment when sharing such info, and believing no one will take advantage of that to compete against it.

And besides, it is not convenient economically wise for yourself, to go in direct competition against something else similar and more popular than you.


Edit: Then of course, everyone is entitled to have its own sense of friendship and marketing philosophy.  

I dunno. Like honestly in my case, if SGP releases Family Vacation and somebody else makes Oar Trail, I would enthusiastically play and enjoy both titles; I wouldn't see any "competition" between them. I suppose you're right SOME folks might buy only one or the other, hence competition, but it's not really a competition in the end because it's all about personal taste. Someone might find Oar trail more appealing because they like pirates, Family Vacation because they like the Chevy Chase movies. I.e. You can't really compete in this space. It's not making a better mouse trap, it's making original works of art all your own. There is no competition. *edit* I know that sounds weird since there is a nesdev compo and people win it, but...I just can't see any of it as a competition.

*edit* I guess I just like to try as hard as I can to *literally* preserve how my brain was at age 10. There was no scene to compete with. There was only me and the games I played and my imagination and my childlike wish to "make a game like that someday." As much as possible I am trying to preserve that state of mind in its absolute purity. I find everything else to be a distraction. If it didn't occur to me at age 10, it doesn't occur to me now.

"The amount of money that people today is willing to invest in a cart of an Oregon Trail like game" is a limited resource.

I think it would be economically better for two subjects designing games, to propose two completely different things.

I can be wrong. Of course.

I am not expert in economy, I just run a little freelance business; so, just my two cents, take them for what they are worth.

In the end, I was just asking if someone else is developing an Oregon Trail like at this time, I had my answer, and I am very happy for Beau that his project was not abandoned.  

Besides, I have people investing money on my working hours, so I must play extremely safe, because I do not want them to face a loss, and I must worry about that too. So, I would definitely prefer to explore another niche sub-genre no one else is working on it at this time, since I believe it would be a potentially better marketing choice.

Edit: correction.

this thread has dysentery and has died.

I mean, the amount of money people are willing to pay for indie games is a limited resource period. Should we all get in a line and only release one homebrew at a time? I guess I see two, well differentiated Oregon Trail clones to be no different than somebody releasing an Oregon Trail clone on the one hand, and a tetris clone on the other. Money's still a limited resource. I think people should just make what they want. Like, say I was NEW to this scene and I had a half completed Oar Trail, then found out about Family Vacation. I'd release it anyway, and if I were SGP, I would be happy about it (personally). It's like: just let the chips fall where they may. We can't control the market. We can just make games, and people will buy what they buy.