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Do you consider the NWC as part of a "complete set"? Poll inside

Mar 3, 2013 at 12:41:40 PM
DreamStar (17)
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I certainly will ,thanks for looking out!And I agree 100% with everything you have posted.Congrats on the Volleyball!

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Do unto other's as you have them do unto you: Matthew 7:12


Edited: 03/03/2013 at 12:51 PM by DreamStar

Mar 3, 2013 at 7:15:55 PM
buyatari2 (30)

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Ohhh noo......

Who bumped this?

Mar 3, 2013 at 9:22:22 PM
sharpguy (0)
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No, NWC is NOT part of the complete set. Sorry. It was never commercially released and it does not have a serial code or a part number. It's not part of the complete set, but it is still extremely cool to collect and will elevate an already great collection to a level so much higher to a person that does own one.

Mar 4, 2013 at 4:11:37 AM
Kosmic StarDust (44)
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I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...

-------------------------
~From the Nintendo/Atari addict formerly known as StarDust4Ever...


Edited: 03/04/2013 at 04:13 AM by Kosmic StarDust

Mar 4, 2013 at 6:24:22 AM
DreamStar (17)
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Originally posted by: stardust4ever

I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...







I agree with you when you say NWC is not part of a complete set ,but I disagree with you about Stadium Events because not only did it have a commercial release it also has a Nintendo license seal of approvel .In my opinion just because one does not own something doen't mean it is't part of a complete set.And on the other hand just because one owns something doesn't make part of a complete set.

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Do unto other's as you have them do unto you: Matthew 7:12

Mar 4, 2013 at 6:47:25 AM
Kosmic StarDust (44)
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Originally posted by: DreamStar

Originally posted by: stardust4ever

I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...



I agree with you when you say NWC is not part of a complete set ,but I disagree with you about Stadium Events because not only did it have a commercial release it also has a Nintendo license seal of approvel .In my opinion just because one does not own something doen't mean it is't part of a complete set.And on the other hand just because one owns something doesn't make part of a complete set.

FYI, I own Ultimate Frogger Challenge (homebrew). I don't cosider it necessary for a "complete" set. I don't own Flinstones 2, Bubble Bobble 2, or Little Samson, but I believe they should be required. As a gamer, I consider all three Pacmans to be the same game, but the licensed and unlicensed versions of Ms Pacman and Tetris to be vastly different. I also consider Super Mario / Duck Hunt to be equivalent to owning both carts. Also, I consider Stadium Events to be the same game as World Class Track Meet as far as gameplay is concerned. Quite frankly, I believe people should just collect games for the joy of playing them and not as trophies to hoard. If I find a game in my collection that I do not enjoy playing, I sell it back so someone else can enjoy it, even if it means selling to the local used game store at a loss. I'm in the hobby for personal enjoyment, not to make money by reselling. Cart only will give you the same experience gameplay-wise as CIB, so I will buy whatever option is available for the cheapest price. And I get just as much enjoyment out of my $55 translucent blue NWC repro as I would have a $20,000 gold one. People will disagree with me on this. I have my opinion of what is worthy to collect and others may have their opinions. I typically don't pay more than $50 for a game (although new games tend to fetch $60 +tax), and I don't believe any game cart is worth adding to my collection for over $100. Otherwise, there is PowerPak...

-------------------------
~From the Nintendo/Atari addict formerly known as StarDust4Ever...

Mar 4, 2013 at 6:48:53 AM
fcgamer (101)

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Originally posted by: stardust4ever

I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...
What about the sucky Tengen titles?  What about the Codemasters games?  Some of them were better than many of the licensed titles.  Hell, there are even other unlicensed games from other companies (some Chinese) that are of an excellent quality too, and better than a lot of the licensed stuff.  People can collect whatever they want, and I respect your opinions on this matter, but for me it just seems a bit hokey to consider a complete set to be equal to the licensed set + the Tengen games, just due to the average quality of their games.

Also, I am not sure why the difficulty ranking of how is / hard the set is to complete would factor into whether it should or shouldn't be included in a "complete" set.  This sort of logic or reasoning st doesn't make sense to me (not pointing fingers at you specifically, btw, but to many on here as a whole).  

Perhaps we should all take a step back and look at the term "the complete set" in a different manner,  I dare to suggest that a truly complete collection would include the following items:

-All licensed NES games 
-Region exclusives that don't fall into the above category for your own region
-Promotionals, service carts, Racermate, etc - the odd things that don't fit in anywhere else
-Unlicensed games (broken from this category into subsets by publisher)
-Homebrew titles
-Repros (omg, did tracker actually suggest this in a post?!?!)

If you collect PAL games, then I still think it would be necessary to have a full set of games if you just went ahead and bought the few NTSC exclusives, and vice-versa for the NTSC collectors.  For the small number of exclusive releases, it almost feels to me that if one went that far with his or her collecting, why not just go the final step and get the last ones?

Though many here do not agree with the idea of including the service carts, NWC and stuff like that in the set, I personally feel that they should be considered part of a truly complete set.  The games were designed for the Nintendo, and they were produced in reasonable quantities (unlike prototypes, where in some cases, maybe only one copy was even produced).  Definitely a unique part of the set, but I still would find these necessary.

WIth the unlicensed games, I would just break it down by publisher.  With the licensed set I would do the same thing too.  Complete the Capcom set, the HES set, the Color Dreams set, the Konami set, etc.  This removes a lot of the gripes from the equation, I think.

Homebrew titles, just get them all.  Another unique category, but some of them are well done, and they were meant to be played on the NES.

Repros - I personally would stick to getting the repros of the unreleased games (Airball, Happy Camper, etc), but some others might even want to go so far as to get ENglish translations of Japanese-exclusive titles.

By the time you were done with this collection, you would basically have a copy of every game created for the NES.  Now that is what a complete collection should be, imo, talk about being complete!


-------------------------
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https://famicomfamilybits.wordpre...
 

Mar 4, 2013 at 7:04:18 AM
DreamStar (17)
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Originally posted by: stardust4ever

Originally posted by: DreamStar

Originally posted by: stardust4ever

I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...



I agree with you when you say NWC is not part of a complete set ,but I disagree with you about Stadium Events because not only did it have a commercial release it also has a Nintendo license seal of approvel .In my opinion just because one does not own something doen't mean it is't part of a complete set.And on the other hand just because one owns something doesn't make part of a complete set.

FYI, I own Ultimate Frogger Challenge (homebrew). I don't cosider it necessary for a "complete" set. I don't own Flinstones 2, Bubble Bobble 2, or Little Samson, but I believe they should be required. As a gamer, I consider all three Pacmans to be the same game, but the licensed and unlicensed versions of Ms Pacman and Tetris to be vastly different. I also consider Super Mario / Duck Hunt to be equivalent to owning both carts. Also, I consider Stadium Events to be the same game as World Class Track Meet as far as gameplay is concerned. Quite frankly, I believe people should just collect games for the joy of playing them and not as trophies to hoard. If I find a game in my collection that I do not enjoy playing, I sell it back so someone else can enjoy it, even if it means selling to the local used game store at a loss. I'm in the hobby for personal enjoyment, not to make money by reselling. Cart only will give you the same experience gameplay-wise as CIB, so I will buy whatever option is available for the cheapest price. And I get just as much enjoyment out of my $55 translucent blue NWC repro as I would have a $20,000 gold one. People will disagree with me on this. I have my opinion of what is worthy to collect and others may have their opinions. I typically don't pay more than $50 for a game (although new games tend to fetch $60 +tax), and I don't believe any game cart is worth adding to my collection for over $100. Otherwise, there is PowerPak...





And I respect your opinion as a collecter/player ,I don't own Stadium Events because to me the game is nothing more than a really rare version of World Track Meet .Some people would say the same about the NWC cart that's nothing more than a hyped up competition cart and that's fine.But to me NWC is more than just a really rare competition cart,it's also a piece of American gaming history.Now I acknowledge the fact Stadium Events is too an important part of gaming history ,but NWC has a far more interesting history and story to go with it than Stadium Events.But like you said everyone has right to his/or her opinions.

-------------------------
Do unto other's as you have them do unto you: Matthew 7:12


Edited: 03/04/2013 at 07:06 AM by DreamStar

Mar 4, 2013 at 7:11:06 AM
Kosmic StarDust (44)
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Originally posted by: tracker465

Originally posted by: stardust4ever

I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...
What about the sucky Tengen titles?  What about the Codemasters games?  Some of them were better than many of the licensed titles.  Hell, there are even other unlicensed games from other companies (some Chinese) that are of an excellent quality too, and better than a lot of the licensed stuff.  People can collect whatever they want, and I respect your opinions on this matter, but for me it just seems a bit hokey to consider a complete set to be equal to the licensed set + the Tengen games, just due to the average quality of their games.

Also, I am not sure why the difficulty ranking of how is / hard the set is to complete would factor into whether it should or shouldn't be included in a "complete" set.  This sort of logic or reasoning st doesn't make sense to me (not pointing fingers at you specifically, btw, but to many on here as a whole).  

Perhaps we should all take a step back and look at the term "the complete set" in a different manner,  I dare to suggest that a truly complete collection would include the following items:

-All licensed NES games 
-Region exclusives that don't fall into the above category for your own region
-Promotionals, service carts, Racermate, etc - the odd things that don't fit in anywhere else
-Unlicensed games (broken from this category into subsets by publisher)
-Homebrew titles
-Repros (omg, did tracker actually suggest this in a post?!?!)

If you collect PAL games, then I still think it would be necessary to have a full set of games if you just went ahead and bought the few NTSC exclusives, and vice-versa for the NTSC collectors.  For the small number of exclusive releases, it almost feels to me that if one went that far with his or her collecting, why not just go the final step and get the last ones?

Though many here do not agree with the idea of including the service carts, NWC and stuff like that in the set, I personally feel that they should be considered part of a truly complete set.  The games were designed for the Nintendo, and they were produced in reasonable quantities (unlike prototypes, where in some cases, maybe only one copy was even produced).  Definitely a unique part of the set, but I still would find these necessary.

WIth the unlicensed games, I would just break it down by publisher.  With the licensed set I would do the same thing too.  Complete the Capcom set, the HES set, the Color Dreams set, the Konami set, etc.  This removes a lot of the gripes from the equation, I think.

Homebrew titles, just get them all.  Another unique category, but some of them are well done, and they were meant to be played on the NES.

Repros - I personally would stick to getting the repros of the unreleased games (Airball, Happy Camper, etc), but some others might even want to go so far as to get ENglish translations of Japanese-exclusive titles.

By the time you were done with this collection, you would basically have a copy of every game created for the NES.  Now that is what a complete collection should be, imo, talk about being complete!
 

You make a valid point. I collect a lot of stuff outside the accepted "complete NTSC set" I tracked down a hard-to-find adapter that lets me play famicom games on a lockot-disabled NES. Lots of great Japan exclusive arcade ports from early in the Famicom's life cycle are not available as 72-pin carts, yet they are a blast to play. I also have one PAL game, 3-in-1 SMB/Tetris/World Cup. I decided I wanted every multicart / standalone variant of Super Mario Brothers / Duck hunt because they were very cheap to collect, which led me to import the PAL 3-in-1 which was different. The sped-up tempo of PAL-optimized Super Mario Brothers is a refreshing challenge, and the Koopa/1UP trick doesn't work. Tetris is also more challenging. I also have every pinball game for NES. This included the Famicom exclusive "Super Pinball." I guess I was a little biased towards Tengen. I do own several other unlicensed games, including Mermaids of Atlantis (the PG version of Bubble Bath Babes) and Maxi-15 from AVE, Baby Boomer and Bible Adventures in baby blue Color Dreams carts, gold plated Quattro Arcade and Bee-52 from Camerica, etc. Still don't have micro Machines although I own that for the Genesis. Also, I've got numerous repros and homebrews in transparent RetroUSB cases. My favorite RetroUSB repros are "Shoot-the-dog" VS Duck Hunt, DK "Pie" Foundry, and SMB2j with level select.  One of the coolest homebrews in my collection isn't really a game at all but Brad Smith's MOON8. I'm also a fan of Pink Floyd, too! I guess thinking as a gamer, I've ventured out of the NTSC set a good bit, into unlicensed and even homebrew territory looking for new experiences. Unlicensed, homebrew, and Japan exclusives often have a whimsical feel to them that you would not find in the states.

-------------------------
~From the Nintendo/Atari addict formerly known as StarDust4Ever...

Mar 4, 2013 at 7:36:46 AM
NostalgicMachine (8)
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Originally posted by: tracker465

Originally posted by: stardust4ever

I think the licensed set (official Nintendo releases) + the Tengen titles comprise a pretty complete set. I consider Tengen on par with the other 3rd party developers even though they're not licensed. A complete Tengen set is also relatively easy to obtain compared to most other unlicensed companies. Of course, I collect to play so I could care less about CIB titles or owning one of everything. CD based games are of course an exception to that rule.

NWC was never sold by Nintendo, and Stadium Events was recalled, so I don't count either of those...
What about the sucky Tengen titles?  What about the Codemasters games?  Some of them were better than many of the licensed titles.  Hell, there are even other unlicensed games from other companies (some Chinese) that are of an excellent quality too, and better than a lot of the licensed stuff.  People can collect whatever they want, and I respect your opinions on this matter, but for me it just seems a bit hokey to consider a complete set to be equal to the licensed set + the Tengen games, just due to the average quality of their games.

Also, I am not sure why the difficulty ranking of how is / hard the set is to complete would factor into whether it should or shouldn't be included in a "complete" set.  This sort of logic or reasoning st doesn't make sense to me (not pointing fingers at you specifically, btw, but to many on here as a whole).  

Perhaps we should all take a step back and look at the term "the complete set" in a different manner,  I dare to suggest that a truly complete collection would include the following items:

-All licensed NES games 
-Region exclusives that don't fall into the above category for your own region
-Promotionals, service carts, Racermate, etc - the odd things that don't fit in anywhere else
-Unlicensed games (broken from this category into subsets by publisher)
-Homebrew titles
-Repros (omg, did tracker actually suggest this in a post?!?!)

If you collect PAL games, then I still think it would be necessary to have a full set of games if you just went ahead and bought the few NTSC exclusives, and vice-versa for the NTSC collectors.  For the small number of exclusive releases, it almost feels to me that if one went that far with his or her collecting, why not just go the final step and get the last ones?

Though many here do not agree with the idea of including the service carts, NWC and stuff like that in the set, I personally feel that they should be considered part of a truly complete set.  The games were designed for the Nintendo, and they were produced in reasonable quantities (unlike prototypes, where in some cases, maybe only one copy was even produced).  Definitely a unique part of the set, but I still would find these necessary.

WIth the unlicensed games, I would just break it down by publisher.  With the licensed set I would do the same thing too.  Complete the Capcom set, the HES set, the Color Dreams set, the Konami set, etc.  This removes a lot of the gripes from the equation, I think.

Homebrew titles, just get them all.  Another unique category, but some of them are well done, and they were meant to be played on the NES.

Repros - I personally would stick to getting the repros of the unreleased games (Airball, Happy Camper, etc), but some others might even want to go so far as to get ENglish translations of Japanese-exclusive titles.

By the time you were done with this collection, you would basically have a copy of every game created for the NES.  Now that is what a complete collection should be, imo, talk about being complete!
 
This is a very thorough analysis, Tracker465. I suppose it's really going to depend on the collector and their goals.



Mar 4, 2013 at 7:51:17 AM
DreamStar (17)
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It does solely depend on the collecter/buyer on what he/or she wants to collect and ultimately invest in,it's plain and simple.

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Do unto other's as you have them do unto you: Matthew 7:12


Edited: 03/04/2013 at 07:55 AM by DreamStar

Mar 4, 2013 at 8:07:32 AM
NostalgicMachine (8)
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Originally posted by: DreamStar

It does solely depend on the collecter/buyer on what he/or she wants to collect and ultimately invest in,it's plain and simple.


Apparently it isn't that simple if it took 25 pages to get here lol.

Mar 4, 2013 at 8:11:52 AM
DreamStar (17)
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Originally posted by: NostalgicMachine

Originally posted by: DreamStar

It does solely depend on the collecter/buyer on what he/or she wants to collect and ultimately invest in,it's plain and simple.


Apparently it isn't that simple if it took 25 pages to get here lol.





That's because the subject about NWC being part of a complete collection or not has been debated about it seems like forever .I have always said it's not ,and I own one and even I don't think it should included.

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Do unto other's as you have them do unto you: Matthew 7:12

Mar 4, 2013 at 8:42:53 AM
fcgamer (101)

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Originally posted by: DreamStar

Originally posted by: NostalgicMachine

Originally posted by: DreamStar

It does solely depend on the collecter/buyer on what he/or she wants to collect and ultimately invest in,it's plain and simple.


Apparently it isn't that simple if it took 25 pages to get here lol.



That's because the subject about NWC being part of a complete collection or not has been debated about it seems like forever .I have always said it's not ,and I own one and even I don't think it should included.
I think it should be counted in there somewhere.  As I mentioned earlier, I think it is a disservice to exclude those titles, but at the same time, I realize that not everyone is able to spend the cash, or willing to go the extra distance to get the test carts and stuff like that.  If we try to move away from this idea of collecting a "complete set", however, and look more as a complete set being made up of a large group of semi-obtainable subsets, then it would perhaps be a compromise that would make everyone happy.  

Why don't we compare the "complete" NES set to the bundles of NES consoles released by Nintendo?

At the very least, for a complete set you need all of the NTSC / PAL games in your region.  THis would be akin to getting the NES set with SMB as the pack in.

Those who want a more complete set would go for the unlicened games or homebrews or promos or something else.  That would be akin to the set with SMB/DH as the pack in and the zapper.

etc etc.

Each collector has his or her own goal as to what he or she wants to collect.  Just acknowledge that there are different levels/tiers of completeness, and go from there.  Someone who has all the licensed NTSC NES games would be happy that his or her collection is considered complete, for all intents and purposes, but someone who has everything would also have a complete collection, just on a different level.  And that would be to everyone's own personal preferance.



-------------------------
-----
Family Bits:  An Unauthorized, Complete Guide to Famicom, Dendy, and Pegasus

https://famicomfamilybits.wordpre...
 

Mar 4, 2013 at 8:54:43 AM
Kosmic StarDust (44)
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Another quick point to add; the NES set is pretty clear, and 16-bit and up systems are very clear as to what constitutes a complete set since unlicensed games were pretty much dead during the 16-bit and up era consoles.

However, with the Atari VCS/2600, there exist more unlicensed games than licensed. I've been hanging out at Atariage a whole lot, and nobody there really seems to be busting their balls over completing a set. A "complete" Atari set would also necessarily include Air Raid, which is about as rare and ubiquitous as the gold NWC (only 25 Air Raids were produced, and probably less survive intact today), and even the Dead Sea Scrolls is largely considered to be the first Atari homebrew, which has only two known copies. The closest NES equivalent is Cheetahmen II, and there's a lot more of those to go around. So without a doubt, it is very likely that noone on Earth has a complete Atari VCS/2600 set. And you see R8-R9 rares selling for $20-$50 bucks on Ebay, a far cry from the hundreds that some loose NES carts fetch! Then you factor in a thriving Atari homebrew community that puts the NES selection to shame (no offense to any homebrew NES programmers; there are simply way more homebrews floating about for Atari, despite the fact remains NES was my first love and is still my favorite console).

-------------------------
~From the Nintendo/Atari addict formerly known as StarDust4Ever...