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"Reproduction" Flintstones Surprise at Dinosaur Peak yep.....

Mar 1, 2014 at 11:04:45 PM
Diamante Loco (149)
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(gblock mountaineer) < King Solomon >
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Source: http://www.famicomworld.com/forum...

I know he has reproduction label on it....but come on, that's too damn close for comfort don't ya think?

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The User formally known as g_block. Same nice guy, different name :-)

Mar 2, 2014 at 12:59:49 AM
gwyndion (322)
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(Cookie Monster) < King Solomon >
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Way too close.

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If anyone is LOOKING for certain repro/homebrews, I have a running repro company thread going as well as a lot of extras myself which include Limited Editions as well.  I'm also free to help answer questions and point people in the right direction so never hesitate to ask!  Here is the current list of repro companies.  Please let me know if I need to update it:
http://www.nintendoage.com/forum/...


Mar 2, 2014 at 1:01:32 AM
guillavoie (125)
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(Der Graue Kasten) < Master Higgins >
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5 screw

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Mar 2, 2014 at 1:10:02 AM
Sp0rtz (12)
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< Meka Chicken >
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Looks Amazing!

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Always looking for "minty" loose nes games.  If you have some PM me!
***I have a USA Shipping Address as well***

Mar 2, 2014 at 2:00:05 AM
Nesmaster (57)
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Flint...

This one has been on and off posted on ebay since November as well. The seller is even willing to take like $300 off the pair if you pay by cheque privately off ebay! I only know because after being blocked by the seller, dingus emails me mistakenly and says so.

Mar 2, 2014 at 3:15:16 AM
Elijah (161)
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(John (JD) Heins) < Wiz's Mom >
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a TransAm500 production?

I think all these are coming from this asstard. Looks like his work. 5 screw, and reproduction in fine print lower left corner.

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Selling everything.
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Mar 2, 2014 at 5:26:22 AM
lojack44 (99)
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Just found another one with same label, $129 BIN, but at least he states it's a repro...

Mar 2, 2014 at 1:24:57 PM
Enternal (19)
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11 of these sold right here http://www.ebay.com/itm/NES-Flint...

Here's your sculptors cut replacement http://www.ebay.com/itm/N64-Clay-...

I wouldn't worry too much, just have a key with you and check the boards for any significant purchase.

Mar 2, 2014 at 10:44:48 PM
Tanooki (185)
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^^Tbat reproduction label guy, has anyone here ever bought off him to see what kind of quality his choice of label and ink are? He's been around awhile and it doesn't appear to get a lot of complaints visible about it.

I think we've gone over this on NA quite a few times before about this dude, just don't feel like looking it up. Each time I know members wrote ebay to get his work pulled and I don't think ebay cared even once to bother which says a lot for ebay and their standards. That there is ok, but a members Action52 got flagged after the fact for copyright and stuff.

Mar 3, 2014 at 2:05:26 AM
pegboy (44)
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I'm at the point where I just don't care anymore. There's clearly a market for this kind of stuff and so might as well just let it happen. It's no different from making bootlegs of Japanese games and calling them "reproductions" (which apparently is just fine on NA).

I do feel sorry for new collectors that have to wade through all this crap to try and get the real stuff, but they should educate themselves before buying this stuff. In the last couple of years it seems the amount of bootlegs has skyrocketed, and I really doubt it's going to slowdown any time soon.

Mar 3, 2014 at 2:13:59 AM
Jerbilly (62)
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Originally posted by: pegboy

It's no different from making bootlegs of Japanese games and calling them "reproductions" (which apparently is just fine on NA).

I may be wrong but that seems to be a bit of oversimplifying there.


Mar 3, 2014 at 2:26:32 AM
pegboy (44)
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Originally posted by: deathrock83

Originally posted by: pegboy

It's no different from making bootlegs of Japanese games and calling them "reproductions" (which apparently is just fine on NA).

I may be wrong but that seems to be a bit of oversimplifying there.
 
Not really.  People make and sell bootlegs of expensive famicom games (Recca and Gimmick for instance) all day long around here.  They pretend that it's not because those games costs hundreds of dollars by the lame "it wasn't released in the US" cop out.  But that's all it is, a cop out.  You don't need to know a single japanese character to play either of these games.  They don't want to pay a lot of money and import the real games so they make or buy bootlegs on the cheap.

It's all piracy at the end of the day.  Playing the "region" card is complete crap and they know it.




Edited: 03/03/2014 at 02:28 AM by pegboy

Mar 3, 2014 at 2:33:31 AM
Jerbilly (62)
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Originally posted by: pegboy

Not really.  People make and sell bootlegs of expensive famicom games (Recca and Gimmick for instance) all day long around here.  They pretend that it's not because those games costs hundreds of dollars by the lame "it wasn't released in the US" cop out.  But that's all it is, a cop out.  You don't need to know a single japanese character to play either of these games.  They don't want to pay a lot of money and import the real games so they make or buy bootlegs on the cheap.

It's all piracy at the end of the day.  Playing the "region" card is complete crap and they know it.

Hmm... I definitely do see where you are coming from but honestly I'm not sold. Nothing personal, of course, but I really see it as more of a grey area as opposed to simple black and white. Which is unique for me, haha


Mar 3, 2014 at 2:43:15 AM
fcgamer (101)

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Originally posted by: pegboy

Originally posted by: deathrock83

Originally posted by: pegboy

It's no different from making bootlegs of Japanese games and calling them "reproductions" (which apparently is just fine on NA).

I may be wrong but that seems to be a bit of oversimplifying there.
 
Not really.  People make and sell bootlegs of expensive famicom games (Recca and Gimmick for instance) all day long around here.  They pretend that it's not because those games costs hundreds of dollars by the lame "it wasn't released in the US" cop out.  But that's all it is, a cop out.  You don't need to know a single japanese character to play either of these games.  They don't want to pay a lot of money and import the real games so they make or buy bootlegs on the cheap.

It's all piracy at the end of the day.  Playing the "region" card is complete crap and they know it.

 
Agreed.

I've also heard the excuse "well this company isn't making money off of it anymore, and it is a different region / format (i.e. Famicom), so it doesn't matter.  Just more of the same lame arguments.  I remember one of the respectable "repro" people here made a game like that, a "repro" of a rare unlicensed Famicom / NES game.  But the company that had made that game had USED / MARKETED some of their NES games as late as 2008ish , or maybe even later, so that excuse didn't really hold water either.

Just always about people wanting things and not wanting to pay money for them.



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Family Bits:  An Unauthorized, Complete Guide to Famicom, Dendy, and Pegasus

https://famicomfamilybits.wordpre...
 

Mar 3, 2014 at 2:46:38 AM
Jerbilly (62)
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Originally posted by: tracker465

Just always about people wanting things and not wanting to pay money for them.

This isn't meant to start a shitstorm since I don't know all the ins and outs but don't you own 25+ pirate carts? What's the difference, in that case?

Mar 3, 2014 at 2:46:48 AM
guillavoie (125)
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(Der Graue Kasten) < Master Higgins >
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Originally posted by: deathrock83

Originally posted by: pegboy

Not really.  People make and sell bootlegs of expensive famicom games (Recca and Gimmick for instance) all day long around here.  They pretend that it's not because those games costs hundreds of dollars by the lame "it wasn't released in the US" cop out.  But that's all it is, a cop out.  You don't need to know a single japanese character to play either of these games.  They don't want to pay a lot of money and import the real games so they make or buy bootlegs on the cheap.

It's all piracy at the end of the day.  Playing the "region" card is complete crap and they know it.

Hmm... I definitely do see where you are coming from but honestly I'm not sold. Nothing personal, of course, but I really see it as more of a grey area as opposed to simple black and white. Which is unique for me, haha
 

I don't want to overinterpret what's going on in your brain Jeremy, but you may confuse bootleg and forgery. A bootleg is somehow against the law, but it's such a common practice that most people don't really care. Heck, the market was already full of pirate carts in the 80's. Forgery is much more problematic, cause it is made to deceive a buyer looking for an 'authentic' copy of a game.

What pegboy says is pretty much true, bootlegging Recca or Surprise at Dino Peak is about the same thing, as long as the bootleg cart isn't an exact replica of the 'authentic' cart, which would fail in the forgery category..

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Edited: 03/03/2014 at 02:48 AM by guillavoie

Mar 3, 2014 at 2:52:06 AM
Jerbilly (62)
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Originally posted by: guillavoie

What pegboy says is pretty much true, bootlegging Recca or Surprise at Dino Peak is about the same thing, as long as the bootleg cart isn't an exact replica of the 'authentic' cart, which would fail in the forgery category..

I am so lost now, haha. I just meant that selling "reproductions" of games that were only released elsewhere from the States like Super Mario Bros. 2J, for example, is more of a grey subject. Selling bootleg carts like a game that was definitely released here (again, Stateside) is obviously no good but then again, I may be biased seeing as I am from the States. I dunno, I am still trying to figure out what the difference is with everything.

Mar 3, 2014 at 5:08:16 AM
Ipsylos (25)

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Not a grey subject at all, if it was made legitimately in a certain region, and you have access to everything needed to play it, then there's no excuse to pirate the game. Be it translations/bootlegs/remasters, it's all the same really. As it was stated, it's just others excuses, be it money or the ill will to import the real deal, pirating is pirating.

Mar 3, 2014 at 6:32:28 AM
Jerbilly (62)
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Does having access mean altering one's console in order to play a game or perhaps taking an existing game apart in order to obtain the means in which to play it on one's console without modifying it? Again, it's still a grey area to me. This discussion is actually quite interesting so I hope we can continue it without it turning ugly

Mar 3, 2014 at 7:06:40 AM
SwiftFrost (200)
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There isn't a grey area for reproductions/bootlegs/pirates. It's illegal because you are selling someone else's IP, violating various IP laws in the process. It's common practice and because the IP holders don't seem to 'care,' no one else does.

I'm with pegboy when it comes to the labels. I feel sorry for all of the newer collectors that have to sift through all the BS these days. But, people are going to do it and there really isn't much anyone can do. There are a lot of people that probably want to upgrade their label for personal use, I'm sure.

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Mar 3, 2014 at 7:36:56 AM
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B.A. (268)
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Eh, at least this one says reproduction. That's about the best you can hope for.

Mar 3, 2014 at 11:20:17 AM
NESnostalgia (23)

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It's getting hard to figure out what is legit and what is not. Thankfully I did most of my collecting before the repo's took off, but now you have to be very careful. I'm glad I follow this community because it is definitely educational.

And this is not going to slow down at all. It is just going to continue to grow.

Mar 3, 2014 at 12:42:46 PM
fcgamer (101)

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Originally posted by: deathrock83

Originally posted by: tracker465

Just always about people wanting things and not wanting to pay money for them.

This isn't meant to start a shitstorm since I don't know all the ins and outs but don't you own 25+ pirate carts? What's the difference, in that case?
A lot of people ask this question to me when these topics arise. In reality, I own hundreds of pirated carts on Famicom (not NES format but playable on NES with an adapter).  Some are multicarts, some are just single carts.  But there are a few things that make these pirated game cartridges much more acceptable to some folks than the stuff that is being discussed in this thread:

1)  The pirated carts that I own were made by Chinese / Taiwanese / Hong Kong game companies back during the Famicom era, namely the 1980s and 1990s.  These weren't made by single people who set out to defraud collectors of millions; rather, these were made by software companies that wanted to make some quick cash via piracy.  Back in the day, interestingly enough, many retailers in Asia actually preferred selling these bootleg games to the originals, as there was a bigger profit margin for the store.  While the consumers certainly knew about whether the game was a fake or not, most didn't care.  

2)  The carts I have are not close replicas, by any means.  Once in awhile I find a bootleg / pirate game that is so close to the original, that most people would have no idea that it was a counterfeit; however, most of the stuff that I have is clearly not an original, with many clearly distinctive signs depicting it for what it is, a bootleg.

3)  The carts that are in my collection were made back during the NES era.  They may be copies of original Nintendo software, but they are period authentic and not modern.

The bootleg Famicom games have always been around, from the start.  No one in the Famicom collecting scene cares about the bootleg copy of Recca that I found and own, nor do they care about the bootleg Little Sampson (Lickle) I have (though I also have a real one), the bootleg Gimmick, etc.  These carts are not being made by collectors or sleazy resellers, and they are easily distinguishable from the official releases.  Many famicom collectors do get up in arms, however, when fans make "reproduction" carts of Recca, for example.  Those carts closely mimick the real game, can be easily confused with the real version, are being made in the modern times, etc.  And that would be the same reason why something like this Flintstones 2 I find to be garbage and quite damaging towards the community, whereas one of the countless pirated carts from back in the day would not be.



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Family Bits:  An Unauthorized, Complete Guide to Famicom, Dendy, and Pegasus

https://famicomfamilybits.wordpre...
 

Mar 3, 2014 at 1:39:01 PM
dra600n (300)
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Originally posted by: tracker465

Originally posted by: deathrock83

Originally posted by: tracker465

Just always about people wanting things and not wanting to pay money for them.

This isn't meant to start a shitstorm since I don't know all the ins and outs but don't you own 25+ pirate carts? What's the difference, in that case?
A lot of people ask this question to me when these topics arise. In reality, I own hundreds of pirated carts on Famicom (not NES format but playable on NES with an adapter).  Some are multicarts, some are just single carts.  But there are a few things that make these pirated game cartridges much more acceptable to some folks than the stuff that is being discussed in this thread:

1)  The pirated carts that I own were made by Chinese / Taiwanese / Hong Kong game companies back during the Famicom era, namely the 1980s and 1990s.  These weren't made by single people who set out to defraud collectors of millions; rather, these were made by software companies that wanted to make some quick cash via piracy.  Back in the day, interestingly enough, many retailers in Asia actually preferred selling these bootleg games to the originals, as there was a bigger profit margin for the store.  While the consumers certainly knew about whether the game was a fake or not, most didn't care.  

2)  The carts I have are not close replicas, by any means.  Once in awhile I find a bootleg / pirate game that is so close to the original, that most people would have no idea that it was a counterfeit; however, most of the stuff that I have is clearly not an original, with many clearly distinctive signs depicting it for what it is, a bootleg.

3)  The carts that are in my collection were made back during the NES era.  They may be copies of original Nintendo software, but they are period authentic and not modern.

The bootleg Famicom games have always been around, from the start.  No one in the Famicom collecting scene cares about the bootleg copy of Recca that I found and own, nor do they care about the bootleg Little Sampson (Lickle) I have (though I also have a real one), the bootleg Gimmick, etc.  These carts are not being made by collectors or sleazy resellers, and they are easily distinguishable from the official releases.  Many famicom collectors do get up in arms, however, when fans make "reproduction" carts of Recca, for example.  Those carts closely mimick the real game, can be easily confused with the real version, are being made in the modern times, etc.  And that would be the same reason why something like this Flintstones 2 I find to be garbage and quite damaging towards the community, whereas one of the countless pirated carts from back in the day would not be.

 

All of your reasons are just trying to justify you accepting one method of piracy over the other. That's fine, and people shouldn't care what you do with your money. That respect you receive for your methods of supporting piracy should be reciprocated, which is clearly not the case ever with you and a few other members.



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Proud owner of post #1800 in Inner Circle HQ thread

Mar 3, 2014 at 1:47:47 PM
cradelit (21)
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The difference is dead simple, deception: counterfeit, no deception: bootleg. The market for these is people who want make money off fooling people who don't look too close into thinking they are buying the real thing. When they are close enough to deceive at a glance, even if the guy has REPRODUCTION in huge letters everywhere on his ebay post, the market who would buy them are scammers. The chinese bootlegs are just infringing on copyright without attempting to deceive which is a separate issue

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GRRR!


Edited: 03/03/2014 at 01:48 PM by cradelit