I think they could get an unpaid high school intern to improve the overall design as well.

I called them back. Unfortunately, the guy who takes credit card payments is out to lunch at the moment so I was unable to pay. Wow!

Usually takes a day or so before the item(s) are "qued" into the system and the CC info works. Same w/comics...but it is usually there within 24 hrs

Wait is that for real? There isn’t a backup person at least?

 

SSL? They (seemingly) store passwords in plain text format   When you register for the website the next page after registration asks you to confirm your information, along with your password visible in plain text...that doesn't seem like it should be possible.

If they do store their stuff in plaintext then there is a veritable TREASURE TROVE of information for hackers to steal there. Credit Card info, passwords, emails, names, and addresses of wealthy individuals who can spend thousands to tens of thousands of dollars on collectors items? All of which likely have some fantastic credit ripe for indentity theft?

Seems a bit scary really. But I could be 110.5% wrong and maybe it's secured  

Its not secure. If you forget your password they email it to you in plain text.

well i mean a 7.0 rev-a excitebike sold for $751.... so the turtles and CV were steals in retrospect.  I don't think collectors quite know how hard it is to get 9.6s on CIBs.  I'd MUCH rather have a 9.6 CIB than an 8.5 sealed. The box is nicer and it is essentially new but opened.  There will come a day when people stop valuing plastic on a box and place value on actual overall condition.  9.6 box is a 9.6 box. 8.5 box is an 8.5 box. that's just it.
 

They have been around a long time. Take Am's advice and wait 24 hours. It will be fine. They want your money trust me.

No.  The excitebike went high, but I bet a sealed excitebike round seal would have gone much higher than that.  

The issue I have with your line of thought, while I understand 9.6 cibs are probably legitimately tough, is the way that wata 
a) grades the parts on average for cibs, yet
b) only grades the box for sealed.   

In other words, open up a 8.5 sealed and you'll have a 8.5 box, "100% complete" contents, and 9.8 or at worst 9.6 on the manual and cart.     That sealed 8.5 in other words is likely a 9.4 cib the minute you pop the cello because the cart manual etc will bring the average grade up, to say nothing of the extra contents.

Moreover, I've never seen an opened game that didn't have a crack line on the back.   IMO its unsightly and I'd personally never give an opened game a 9.6 in the first place.

You probably have a different POV and that's fine, but let's not pretend its 'all about the cellophane.'     Its about rarity differential, about being completely unused, and about the contents being completely mint and complete.  

I get what you're saying in theory, in that a truly gem cib (like the 1 out of 1000 copy) might be worth what some lower grade sealed copy is worth.   Where that line is, is up for debate, but I'll take the 8.5 sealed any day in your illustration because I don't know that your cib 9.6 even has all the right contents.   I know it has the cart, manual, and box, but anything else that came with the game isn't even part of the cib grade whereas on the sealed copy I not only know its present, I know its present and mint.   

Ultimately the minute you start placing this kind of value on a cib, what happened with qualified VGA games will repeat and the price will correct itself.   HG cib supply will increase through  frankensteining (married parts).    Maybe not at the 9.6 level but at the 9.2 level?  For sure.     You really only need one truly high grade part out of three to average a 9.2 or even 9.4.   (say 9.0, 9.0, 9.8 "averaging" to 9.4).



 

You call the password reset guy and he gives it to you over the phone. 

 

I second this thought. The higher the grade the better, no matter if it's sealed or not. I think when censuses start appearing people will realize the difficulty of CIB grading. Getting higher grades appears to be easier with sealed games in my experiences.

^ I guess cib collectors think grading is too tough on cibs and sealed collectors tend to think the opposite. Hard to change those view points because they are ultimately biased by our entire collections. So try as we might to be impartial an impartial discussion rarely happens.

9.4 on a CIB is extremely tough.  9.6 is legitimately a stellar copy as much as I hate to say it.  I just sent in one of the mintest damn CIBs I've ever seen it only got 9.4.  Felt like it had maybe been opened once or twice (you know, the extremely tight hinge flap feeling), everything inside perfect beautiful to the naked eye.  Still 9.4, though I don't know the cart / box / manual breakout yet.  Hoping the box was a 9.6 at least.

I'm assuming at 9.6 level the cart has probably never been inserted into a NES period.  I'm theorizing here, but maybe inserting into the NES causes some very faint abrasions that affect value.  Because all carts that look Mint to the casual eye are getting docked significant points. 

And your theory is just as flawed as assuming opening a factory sealed case of games automatically means VGA 100 or A++ / 10.  We've seen factory uncirculated fresh games as low as VGA 85 (probably 9.0 A or somewhere there abouts) and same applies to manual on a CIB.  You'd hope the cart is at least 9.8 or so from never being used but I bet the manual would have some wear.

For whatever reason, Wata's sealed scale seems extremely lax.  Getting 9.4 is fairly easy there if you have a good eye.  But on CIB?  9.4 is legitimately the mintest of the mint stuff.  It's really bewildering to be honest.  Also the CIB grading is .5 box, .3 cart, .2 manual, so it's not just about finding one really mint component.  It's about finding a mint box then trying to find an unused cart and finding a virtually unhandled manual.  It's not easy.  It's really just about buying a MINT CIB in the first place because piecing together would be futile on the top end stuff.  You can piece a 7.0 to an 8.0 but you aren't piecing a 9.4 to a 9.6.

I do agree 10.0 CIB shouldn't exist though, so 9.8 (or 9.6 maybe) is realistically the max.  Thus you see how just by the nature of having a smaller scale, a 9.6 CIB is basically perfection while you can still go 2 full grades higher on sealed.  There's some 10.0s out there.

Good points. To be honest, watas sealed scale, watas cib scale, and vgas grades the last few years are all too lax for my liking.   As long as it's consistent , I guess.

I haven't taken the time to think about how a game graded at 8.5 sealed can be upgraded to a 9.X by simply removing the plastic. There's absolutely a marginal profit to be made there *if* plastic had absolutely zero baring on the price. Does WATA put different weights to the grades for constituent parts, or do the three main components have an even 1/3 split of the average? (Also, shouldn't maps be important when included? They're essential to games like Zelda)

Even within the realm of NES collecting there's completely differing views on what "New" actually means. Just hop across the pond to PAL Land and "New" means something that's in pristine condition with 100% CIB parts for most games, most not all. Also, the new people coming in are coming over from comics. I can't possibly imagine a way to tell if a comic was "read" or not, so I don't think they have the same New/Opened culture that we do here, you came over from comics a decade and a half ago so you would know more there.

However, no one can say that $25,000+ for any CIB NES game other than Stadium Events existed prior to mid-2019. The second most expensive NES game CIB prior to 2019 would have been a high grade Qualified DK Math, and *maybe*, just maybe it would get $10k I feel.

You bring up some good points, but I still think the reality of this new collecting world is somewhere in the middle.

Ok, but let me put it this way. I bet a 9.4 or 9.6 matte sealed would get 250+ in the current market.

of course, no one has one to sell.   But it’s worth keeping that in mind when thinking about what the gap is or isn’t.   I’d personally be very comfortable to almost certain of getting a sale at that number if there was a copy like that 

Would it take 6 or 7 people going in on it to inflate it to that price? :-)
 

Agree with Dan. A 9.6 or 9.4 matte would command multiple dollars on the record sale. Such a short time ago, but so much has changed in that short time. Glad to say I got to watch it all unfold  

One thing I noticed is when you go to the credit card account info screen it is indeed a secured URL................

I believe it's imperative that people understand the subgrades. No way would I pay big big money if the CIB I was buying has 9.8 cart 9.6 manual and a 7.5 box. 9.6 on box is special. It's insane actually. The CV and those two turtles that were 9.6s were some of the nicest games I've ever owned. You'll be hard pressed to find nicer copies.

Cute one liner   but I think you underestimate how marketable something like that would be.    To a group yes, and to individuals too.    What's the difference?   Don't forget that last time I turned down a higher offer made later from an individual trying to beat the group to the game.
 

I hear ya, but with graded collectibles people just look at the number on the label for the most part
 

I know, I have to get a jab in when I can.    I really do believe the SMB sticker seal (sealed) is a real rarity. Do you know of any sealed (matte) ones currently in other collections?
 

No

The new people don't care about the old rules. They are too busy making new ones.