UPDATE: 3 years later, I am alive, my PC is not. The charging port is busted, and expensive to replace. Until I can get it to hold a charge, all of my files are essentially in limbo for the mean time.

One good thing is that I was able to find some documentation on how to address the 3 potential issues from the previouos update. Problem is implementing them. The issue is not ASM hacking as I initially believed, but rather hex editing, which is less complicated, but more advanced than anything I've done so far... without destroying the game in the process at least. (My last time hex editing irreversibly corrupted my file, losing days of work. That was 2014, and I haven't tried since lol)

Anyways, this will eventually be a thing. So anyone actually interested in this project can look forward to it eventually being released.


Previous update: I'm alive and well, and surprisingly have been working on this off and on since I disappeared most recently. I'm now at what I would consider the final stretch, all the dungeons are completed, the entire overworld has been updated, all that needs to be done now is some balance adjusting, bug testing (there's some bizarre stuff that happens in some levels...), and we're done!

It's been a long time coming, but to be this close is really satisfying. As per user input, I have made the sword accessable from the beginning, have moved dungeon locations in both quests (with the possible exception of the first one), and made the second quest's dungeons spell out MASTER, with a special and secret layout for the final 3

Some significant issues that I have yet to resolve however:

First: raft screens cannot be moved without a significant amount of ASM hacking, and I have no idea where to even begin on that. As such I have removed the raft entirely, and altered the landscape somewhat to make raft only areas accessable by using the step ladder. Basically I flooded the river, making it 5 wide instead of 3.

Second: the lost woods cannot be moved without Asm hacking. SPOILER: I re-designed the old location into the puzzle to get the first sword. The new location of the lost woods has no lost aspect, just the woods portion. As such, new paths were made in adjacent screens where there were originally no exits.

Third: The screen where you must go up, up, up the mountain cannot be moved without ASM. See a pattern here? I made it into a puzzle in order to reach a secret area. The new mountain is much shorter, and you only need to go up it once.

Now, ASM is a good deal more complex than using a game editor. Or even a hex editor. All in all, I'm unsure if I would ever be able to complete the game if I tried to get it to work via ASM. So, I ask you: Would you still be OK with a Zelda game without a raft? It's prhased better in the polls, please lend your vote.

Aside from those, nearly everything is identical to the original, only mirrored. This would be the part where I ask if a few changes might be better than a 1:1 mirror. All the major landmarks would remain as such, but other less important areas, would it be better if I redesigned certain areas to make the game feel "new?" I'll phrase it better in the polls section, please vote if you're interested.

So, all in all, just some finishing touches, possibly some redesigning if that's your fancy. (redesigns wouldn't add any time to the project. I have a few ideas in mind already, but would understand if they deviated too much from the theme of the game.) All in all, I anticipate a release sometime before you die.

(No, not a physical release, I have no way/desire to do it myself, and really don't want to sell out to flashback or something like that.) (Real talk, maybe 3 months, maybe 6. Depends on how much free time I have.)

BELOW HERE IS THE ORIGINAL POST:

So, I was working on this a while ago, and got 60% done and then I ran out of inspiration. Well, I think I found my inspiration again, and am back in the saddle and ready to finish this! You may ask yourself what I'm talking about, and I wouldn't blame you for not knowing. About a year ago I started work on a hack of the Original Legend of Zelda. My idea was to mirror everything, similar to how they did in Ocarina of Time's Master Quest. I started with the Overworld, moving all the tlies around but not reversing them. Then I made the dungeons. Reversed and made more challenging, although not via backtracking A la Outlands. I ran out of steam after completely reversing and renovating the first 9 dungeons. And now, here I am again! So, "Why is he here?" you may ask yourself. In answer, I have a few decisions to make about the way I continue making the game: Firstly, I was toying with the idea of not allowing the player access to the sword until they complete the third dungeon in the first quest. Does this seem fair to you? I tried out giving the player access to free bombs and a purchasable bow from the start so as to give you a fighting chance, but I don't know how stable an idea that is. Secondly, I wanted to ask if the dungeon entrances should be in the same locations as in the Original, or to mix it up a bit and make the player hunt for them. And then, mix it up for first and second quest, or just second? Lastly, I was toying with the idea of changing the dungeon designs completely for the second quest. Originally they spell Z E L D A and 3 other non letters. I was considering spelling M A S T E R, a triforce shaped level, then an ! shaped level, and having a boss rush in the ! level culminating in the final boss Gannon. So, yeah. Hoping for a vote of confidence from the community. (And also that making rom hacks hasn't become taboo since I visited last.) Hope for some input, and then we can have a decent game for everyone to enjoy!

Not having a sword would really end up pissing me off, since bombs and arrows are a consumable resource. You'd have to be sure players weren't running out at the worst time. I know if I was in the middle of a dungeon and had to back track just to get more arrows or bombs I'd quit right there and most likely never play again. Would it be possible to give them something else in the mean time? Even like a whole new weapon like a dagger with a shorter range and no throwing distance on full hearts?

As far as dungeons and layouts go, I played the Classics more time then I care to admit so Id need new layouts and locations and such to make me want to play again.

at the beginning, but something like Link's Awakening, iirc, the sword was not in the first screen, just some screens down and you had to avoid some enemies to get it

Yeah, games that prevent me from getting the sword until later in the game are hard in all the wrong ways. I don't find anything enjoyable about that.

Would the overworld map be changed as well?

I like making you wait for the sword, depending on the balance of other items that are available at the beginning.

Early access to a bow (and free arrows) would be an interesting mechanic.

Alternatively, nerfing the sword so that they didn't shoot would be a good difficulty adjustment.

If you really got into the guts of the ROM, making are larger group of enemies vulnerable to the boomerang would make swordless play much more survivable and allow you to get back some bombs or rupees for the more powerful bow.



I think a really interesting idea would be to do the following:

(1) hack the sword-slot to contain the bow, permanently (i.e. no swords in the game, at all)

(2) have the silver arrow show up earlier and be multiple times more powerful than the normal arrow

(3) increase enemy vulnerability to the boomerang (so that medium-weak enemies can be killed with a "free-to-use" weapon, to let you recharge ammo)

(4) if you got really extreme in the hacking, figure out how to implement bomb-arrows

(5) obviously you'd need to retool the vulnerability of all sort of enemies (bosses especially) to make the game playable, overall, but I think it would make for a really unique LoZ hack.


And I would make bomb satchel upgrades "free" things that you uncover in hard-to-find dungeon locations.
(especially since arrow-use would represent a larger feature of the game, so spending 100 rupee slugs on bomb upgrades would be iffy)




PS - if you want a playtester, I'd be happy to put my PowerPak to good use.
I've beaten both quests of Outlands, and can do swordless runs in the origina LoZ with no problem.

You present several interesting ideas, very interesting indeed... It's so far beyond my abilities as a hacker it's not even funny, but it's a learning process! I'll respond to each point individually:

1) I like the idea, a lot. Not sure if I'll make that a thing in this game, but I have at least two more potential hacks brewing in my brain, and I think that this just became the hook for one of them! (no promises though...)

2) I don't see that happening early on for numerous reasons. Firstly, the difficulty scaling would be completely shot, the enemies would become impossibly easy unless I scaled them up as well, but there's only three groups of enemies, and scaling one or two up would mean that enemy types would become repetitive, and that's not something I'd want. Second, doing the aforementioned is really, really hard. Lastly, I feel that if I were to do the hack like this, I'd put the silver arrows with the old man who would have given you the magic sword, and as such would only become available after you have earned ten(?) heart containers, and are a good way into the game.

3)Yes. I hadn't thought of this, and I all but guarantee that this will make it into the game. (skills allowing...) I think I'd make it so that only overworld enemies are damaged, and underworld are only stunned (Excepting bats and gels).

4) ...Maybe... Just realize that hex editing is crazy hard, and don't actively expect this to end up a thing. It would be awesome though... but not likely.

5) I think this is doable without too much fuss... I know of at least one application that has this capability without manually editing the hex code, (Which I really want to avoid as much as possible...) but it only runs in DOS. I've looked into DOS box, and that might be something I'd do, but at the same time I don't know if the work I've already done would be compatible with the program... It remains to be seen, but if I need to go through the hex, well, so be it! What's the name of that other forum? Nesattempt or something? Think they'd be able to lead me in the right direction?

5b) And yes, I'd already incorporated the bomb upgrades for free in the first quest. Second quest is supposed to be harder though, so no guarantees they'll be free the second time around.

5c) And yes, I'd love to have you as a beta tester! Anyone who's able to is welcome to once I finish the game and make it available!>
It would indeed. It would be completely mirrored. I'm intimately familiar with the Original map layout, and while playtesting I kept getting lost, it messes with your mind in an interesting way! After testing the mirrored version for a while, It became confusing trying to navigate the Original!

^^^ Yeah, I know I outlined some ambitious ideas. But I feel like some of them represent the bar you need to cross to make the project worthwhile (that is, by exceeding the bar currently set by the likes of Outlands -- it's been over 10 years since that hack was done, but I have yet to see another Zelda hack at that level of thoroughness)

glad to hear you are jumping back into this! i had started one a while back but got pretty burned out on it. did a bunch of redesigning the overworld and got to about the 4th dungeon before i kept getting a glitch with the secret passageway that i couldnt fix so i gave up. i had some new ideas and may start over.

make it as difficult as possible please. having to restart the game due to lack of resource management is fine with me.

I had it that difficult at first, no sword until just before the third dungeon's boss, buy the bow for 50 rupees and the arrows for another 50, no bombs except for 8 leading up to and 4 during the second boss (3 dodongos). I'll be honest, it wasn't very fun, it was crazy hard, and nearly impossible. I did a playthrough of the first dungeon on youtube a while back, I'll check if it's still up. *checks* Nope, sorry, I seem to have taken it down. I'll sift through some files on my computer, but it may be gone for good... Regardless, I'm now considering making an alternate, more difficult version, after I complete the to the one I'm working on now, with impossibe difficulty. Just for lulz. So you may get your wish!

Have you thought about putting this on a cart and selling it?

Naturally, but I won't get anyone's hopes up over a physical release until I've at least completed the game...

mine had the sword not too far from the start, but you still had to do some exploring to get it. i put the blue candle in level 1 and the sword under a bush not far from there and used one of the "pay me and ill talk" rooms nearby in case someone was really stuck.

i should still have the rom i was working on if youre interested in taking a look to bounce some ideas around.

I like the idea of having "pay me and I'll talk" rooms actually give useful information.

(along with the guys in the dungeons)

I can't wait to play the hard version of the original Legend of Zelda.

If you want the hard version of the original, beat it with 3 hearts.

I was just browsing the forum to answer my question if there were any good new hacks around and found this thread.
I must say that the ideas that Arch 8ngel pitched are very interesting and would definitely want to see it happen. I understand you are relatively new to the hacking, I don't know anything about it, but would it be wise to ask someone to help you out in this project. I understand if you want to do it completely on your own, but as Arch 8ngel also said, the bar should be high to make it worthwhile.
I don't think difficulty should be drastically increased for a hack, first of all it should be very interesting and fun to play the game. There is always a second quest where you could go nuts. I found Zelda Outlands very cool and while I died quite frequently on my first run through, I did so much better the second time. What I try to say here is that some hacks are just ridiculously hard that it is sometimes impossible to not take damage. I think the hack would be more successful if the difficulty is more in line with the original, say second quest in LoZ, much like Zelda outlands.

Well, I'm between a rock and a hard place with this one. Here's the dilemma: I have already fabricated the entire game (almost 80% of it as of now) with the original rules of the game in place, ie: you get a sword at some point, arrows cost rupees, boomerang stuns etc. If I were to take the time to rebalance the game physics, all of the actual gameplay would have to be rebalanced as well, and I'm not exactly willing to do that. (It would be the fourth time actually, I made most of the game, then accidentaly corrupted the save file, restarted, lost interest and then chose to restart it.) After reading the nput on here about how difficult the game can be and still be enjoyable, I actually toned down the first quest a good deal. (The second quest will be merciless though.) The first quest is actually complete, and I playtested it a bit, it's challenging but nowhere near as impossible as my first draft. (If you got unlucky with bomb and rupee drops for the first 3 levels, you had to reset.) In the long run, I feel that this game will be an acceptable, albeit difficult, tribute to the Original, using the same rules as thr Original.

Now, I've been toying with the idea of doing a second hack once I am through with this one. (Actually, I've been toying with the idea of de-making Wind Waker into an 8 cartridge epic adventure as well, but that's still in the theorycrafting stage.) Nothing is set in stone yet since I refuse to start planning until I have finished this one completely, but know that I have taken Arch 8ngel's advice into careful consideration, and if I ever get around to it, you will end up seeing some of his ideas in the final game.

Welp. I'm not dead, and I'm back with an update! (Once again, hoping rom hacks haven't become taboo while I've been away.) The game is now over 90% complete! (The 80% mentioned in any previous posts was for a MUCH harder version of the game where you had only arrows, the candle and bombs for 90% of the game, and had to be scrapped completely and rebuilt from the ground up, so I've done MUCH more than just 10% )

Anyways, got a few questions in the OP, got a few new polls active, and I would LOVE some community input before I wrap up development and enter beta testing.

Fun fact: I've been off and on making this for over two years now XD At least it's nearing fruition, unlike my poor poor Megaman saves Christmas hack, may it rest in peace. (It died along with my previous laptop. I forgot to save it before jumping ship...) If anyone ever tells you that rom hacking is fast and easy, they're selling something. Or they just worked on it more consistently than I did...

@eotn: Hey!   never, ever consider all of your efforts in vain. Zelda has such a special place in all of our hearts that however you recreate it, it will be very well received by everyone following your hack's progress. I haven't said anything for a while (well, to be honest, I hadn't even registered all this time..even though I should have), but on behalf of your fellow Zeldians and Linkers, or whatever we want to be called, be encouraged by the game that unites us all. You're among fellow gamers that love this game enough to care about any and every newly conceived installation.

Whenever you're ready to release a beta, and those 80 and 90 percent done ones will do, trust me, we'll be around to beta-test them for you! We're just happy you've built these hacks at all! Thank you for all of your efforts to give us something new to play! We will always appreciate something like this, it's special and if more folks wouldactually know such little zelda hacks exist, they'd be so excited about it, I know we all are!

Now, if I'm understanding your development progress correctly, there are both a very difficult version that's 80 percent complete and a much easier version that's well over 90 percent done, both sound very good and exciting indeed.. I'd honestly suggest you consider beta-releasing both! This will help folks see what you mean as to how hard and how easy you actually mean. I don't mind dying at the hands of cruelly-hard Zelda hack, but newer and younger gamers usually prefer to play simplified, easier to beat gameplay, so both could be perfect for two completely different audiences. I'm in the middle, so I'd surely enjoy both of them, lol!  

Okay my friend, hack-on, don't forget to drop an update or a beta version (or two if you incude the hard one, so please do..lol!) over our way, and pm me any any of the gang here on your thread if you really want it kept from the public eye. But one thing's for sure, we're all ready for it! For all the years working on your labor of love, you're already a champ in my book, just don't forget to share the love with the rest of us your pals!  

Oh, one more thing: you got some votes, including mine, on which way to go on your hacks, but trust me on this: if you end up doing both the workarounds and leaving them where they are and reworking the overworld or not, both will be appreciated. The second one would save you a whole lot of work, but it would sacrifice the originality of the new zelda game, which I know is huge plus for most players. But for the hacks with a familiar overworld, what I most often have seen is a 'tweaked' version of the original overworld where the dungeons have been moved around and the roads have been rerouted to make our hero go in different directions from the orginal, and those hacks, while being minor, are also enjoyable.

...How on earth did you stumble onto this thread? This should have been buried dozens of pages deep in the brewery, wha? (JK, I'm gonna guess you searched Zelda Hacks or something based on your only other post.)

I appreciate the kind words, enough that I'm here right now talking to you. Prior to tonight, my last login was in November of 2015, I know because I got called out in another thread with an unfinished rom hack i started... *blushes*

Long story short, the game sits near complete. I recently found some guides about specific ASM hacks for certain aspects I needed to edit, which will be added to the final version god willing I can figure that out. The current state of the game is in limbo however, as the only copy of it sits on a computer that won't power on, and will cost $150 to fix. That's been the case for over a month, as I type i am using my sister's computer which she graciously lent to me, and until I can set aside that money, game's effectively in limbo. 

That aside, I truly appreciate your apparent passion for zelda, and zelda hacks. In times i got burnt out on working on the zelda masterquest this thread is about, I actually have two seperate zelda hacks I started working on. In fact, I nearly finished one of them. One is an entirely new game based around interesting quirks of the zelda engine to make more interesting dungeons and feature a unique overworld hopefully on par with the original in terms or exploration. The other is based on Breath of the Wild, and my silly atempt to make it into an NES game. Similar to the Master quest however, the only copies sit on my brick of a pc right now. The only thing NOT on that pc is one single image, the overworld of the BoTW hack: https://imgur.com/FW0jpL7...

So, rest assured that I will eventually make these hacks happen, it will just take a bit of time and money to get my PC functioning to save them from the void.

I want to play both of your hacks, so you better straighten up your things and deliver sooner than later  

Amen Brother...LOL...that was really good, Guillavoie!

@EoTN: I hear you. I've learnt to email myself anything remotely important to two separate email accounts. Gmail's also great at uploading my photos using their unlimited storage...God knows they have all of my life in their hands right there.  

I use a Chromebook to keep things simple. My pal who's made a couple of Zelda hacks programs on his own Chromebook..I know, we're both nuts, but you know, if it keeps all the web bugs away, which it does 101 percent, it's all good. He backs-up his hacks like crazy, also learning from his own hard knocks of losing part of a hack or a whole one.

I recently played a half-baked hack uploaded to romhacking.net, but the part that was done was thoroughly enjoyable, so I'm definitely going to encourage him to iron out the kinks so the game can be played beginning to end. It's just that these little games are so addictive!

Now not for the timid, I've carefully removed a (modern) hard drive and connected it to a different desktop to pull files out (I always have several half or non-working units, so that's how I've quickly pulled out important files). Nowadays, I have usb externals and flash drives now to save copies of my files, mostly older docs and images, but my word docs are mostly all on Google.

My Chomebook also has an Android Mac emulator to run really old apps like Photoshop, Word and a bunch of old games. If I want to send someone a document from my old Mac, I just make a PDF of it and off it goes. I play my NES games on a free Android emulator, so my setup is really Retro, but still sweet..I even have a slow little NES emulator on my virtual Mac!

But I'm rambling..whenever you set your precious little Zelda hack free, we'll be right here ready to test it brother, no worries! And if you want to try to dig that hack out, I'll be happy to help out with some how-tos if you're comfortable working on the hardware..that's if both computers are desktops. If it's a laptop, then your best bet is to wait 'til you can fix it, no hurry.

Did you know that you can take out the hard drive and plug it into another computer and get your files?

Even if your hard drive with your files on it is not compatible with any of your other computers there are adapters you can buy that you can plug that hard drive into to then connect to another computer.

Yes. A few things to remember:

- static is not a friend of electronics
- taking out a drive on desktops is generally easier than on laptops
- always make sure that the computer is unplugged and on laptops that the battery is unplugged too
- grounding yourself is a good idea when removing any computer parts

I've put internal hard drives from older desktops inside external enclosures that tun them into external hard drives. The key is to get hard drive connectors that match your drive. You can look up online to see what kind of drive your laptop uses. Again, if you want to go that route, let me know and we can look at some of those options on your computer. Adapters and enclosures generally run $10-15 online.

Keep in mind tht some newer low-end laptops use small, flash-based hard drives that are built-into the main computer board, so backing up your files is crucial on those; a few of these are pretty much touch screen tablets with detachable keyboards.