NintendoAge http://nintendoage.com/forum/ -Sqooner A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-27T23:24:14 -05.00 nothing02 51 Originally posted by: RetroHacker

I am firmly of the belief that the data on these prototype games should be backed up - and backed up well. Once the data is gone, it's gone forever.

That said, there is a "trick" to reading partially bit-rotted EPROMs... read them at a lower voltage. If you power the chip with 4v instead of the usual 5, you have a better chance of getting data from "weak" gates. Not a definite science by any means, but, like putting a failed hard drive in the freezer, it sometimes works - and you have nothing to lose.

-Ian

Wow, that is a great idea. 

How would you go about adjusting the voltage on a typical EPROM programmer?  I would love to give this a shot on some of my more haggard prototypes.

]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-27T23:20:16 -05.00 nothing02 51
That said, there is a "trick" to reading partially bit-rotted EPROMs... read them at a lower voltage. If you power the chip with 4v instead of the usual 5, you have a better chance of getting data from "weak" gates. Not a definite science by any means, but, like putting a failed hard drive in the freezer, it sometimes works - and you have nothing to lose.

-Ian
]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T19:50:46 -05.00 nothing02 51 Originally posted by: jero32

Yeah but that stil doesnt mean you own it. The company might not give a shit about it...they own it.

As I said, many use possession and ownership interchangeably.  Regardless of ownership, in the name of preservation, this community is lucky so many of us possess these things and appreciate them more than the companies that produced them 20 years ago.

Not debating the ownership piece, but I could absolutely care less about who owns the rights to it.  If the "owners" care enough about any of the carts I possess, they can have them back after they win them in court.
]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T18:21:02 -05.00 nothing02 51 A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T17:50:28 -05.00 nothing02 51
Without proto owners caring about possession of the cart/ROM, many of these would be gone to everyone forever.

Just something to think about. ]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T16:32:38 -05.00 nothing02 51 A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T12:46:45 -05.00 nothing02 51 Originally posted by: i2a2n2

ofcourse you'd have to use an eprom eraser to completely blank the eprom because you can't write over the eproms if their is any data on them
This may be too much nerdyness    Each bit is a gate, think fence gate that is open (0) or closed (1).  The gate needs a minimum number of electrons to hold it open, otherwise it swings closed.  

When you erase the chip the UV light makes all the electrons leave, closing every gate on the chip.  A fully erased chip will read all 1s.

Then when you program the chip you are forcing electrons back in, selectively opening only the gates you want.  The chip is not a perfect insulator so electrons will leak out slowly.  

Bit rot happens when enough leak out and there aren't enough electrons left so the gate closes.  It does not happen the other direction because electrons are not being added.  Eventually after a very long time all the bits will rot and the entire chip will be erased.

When reprogramming you are putting the same data back on the chip, so any correct bits will just stay correct.  Any bits that have rotted will already be erased, so the chip doesn't need to be erased before programming them again.  This is important in cases of EPROMs with stickers covering the windows like prototypes.  You won't want to pull those off or damage them, but fortunately you don't have to!
]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T07:51:44 -05.00 nothing02 51
And I guess you could call proto collecting a "fad," at least since I guess it's gonna die once the protos are dead themselves. But I'm sure people could come up with tons of reasons why video game collecting as a whole isn't a fad. This stuff is gonna live on, at least in people's memories... haha. ]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-23T05:39:23 -05.00 nothing02 51
I have to say though, the best prototype ROM releases have come from people not seeking profit. From Demiforce's release of Earthbound for the NES, to the anonymous person who purposely released the binary of StarFox 2, they understood the underlying value of the data. I still think video game collecting is merely a fad, and especially so with something like prototypes that have a shelf life. ]]> A thought about prototypes... http://nintendoage.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=35&threadid=28088 2010-01-22T23:23:20 -05.00 nothing02 51
ofcourse you'd have to use an eprom eraser to completely blank the eprom because you can't write over the eproms if their is any data on them ]]>